11 ms·
Unhappy Meals (2007)
- tobinfekkes 1y agoI was just quoting Pollan yesterday, which is the quote right at the top of the article. "Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants." Succinct, doesn't alienate anyone, or make a lot of rules, or shame you for doing the wrong thing. Don't complicate food. I own a fresh organic produce delivery outfit in the Seattle region, and we basically run our operations off what he explains in more words. The more steps involved between the soil and your mouth, the less "food" it is. It might not kill you, but it also won't help you.
- milesward 1y agoUhm, this sounds yummie, I am in seattle, got a link?
- tobinfekkes 1y agoHope you live north of downtown:) https://boxofgood.com https://boxofgood.com
- criddell 1y agoAre you talking about following a raw food diet?
- tobinfekkes 1y agoNo. Whenever the word "diet" is used with regards to not eating "this" or only eating "that", something has already gone wrong. A "diet" is a voluntary restriction (well, usually after some involuntary event). But you only need to restrict foods with your brain by choice if you first disobey your body's needs. You should not drink Coke because it has WAY too much sugar and WAY too little of anything beneficial. If you tried to consume the amount of sugar in Coke by eating apples, you would be too full long before you get to Coke-level sugar intake. That's because of all the other stuff in an apple; it's not concentrated sugar. Your body is a wonderful thing. Respect it and listen to it, it will keep you healthy. That's literally its job, and it only knows how to repair and heal you. It will keep the things it needs, and discard the rest. You can't "over-consume" if you eat real foods. Your body won't let you; you'll get full and stop. You can only over-eat engineered foods, which over-saturate sugar|fat|carbs|salt|etc, which then necessitates a "diet".
- criddell 1y ago> A "diet" is a voluntary restriction The word "diet" is not always about restriction. Surely you've heard people use the term "standard American diet" which doesn't have anything to do with restriction. I assume you are talking about a raw diet (not necessarily calorie restricted diet) because of your comment about minimizing steps between soil and mouth.
- thwarted 1y agoThis description of the word "diet" is overly simplistic and marketing centric. A diet is just the schedule (list) of foods consumed, as in "I have a terrible diet" or in "pandas exist on a diet of bamboo shoots and leaves". This term is overloaded in areas like the weight-loss industry to refer to voluntary limited intake, but it's still a diet as in an enumerated schedule of specific foods. "Going on a diet" is often used in the context of specific health goals as distinct from the normal "diet". There's an episode of Mad Men where they are coming up with pitches for weight loss products and losing weight is referred to as "reducing", a term from before the word "diet" was used as you've described.
- zahlman 1y agoYou would be full eating three medium-sized apples (https://www.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/apples https://www.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/usda/apples ; https://www.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/coca-cola/coca-cola-classic-(12-oz) https://www.fatsecret.com/calories-nutrition/coca-cola/coca-... ), with (by my back of the envelope calculation) not much more total volume than the can of Coke? Would this be longer lasting than the bloated feeling from the carbonation? Have you tested this?
- drjasonharrison 1y agoUh, no? Taking plants from the soil, or fruits from the tree/vine, and trimming, washing, cutting, and cooking are typically considered steps that are unavoidable for some plants. The difference between a baked potato, potato chips, and Pringles is what we're talking about. The oil used for potato chips (and Pringles) originated from plants, but it has undergone several steps from plant to container of oil.
- vladvasiliu 1y agoAren't chips blown to smithereens and then reconstructed with the help of all those random ingredients? I think this is what "ultra-processed" means and what differentiates these foods from getting your bag of potatoes and frying them at home. I don't know about Pringles / Lays &c, but I've never seen two potatoes of the same size and shape in a bag, so there must be some way they manage to get all their chips to look the same.
- badc0ffee 1y agoPringles are reconstituted from powdered potato - which should be obvious as they're all the the same size and shape, and have a weird texture. Lays and nearly every other brand are just thinner versions of potato chips you could make yourself at home (cut thin, fry in oil, dress in salt). Nothing "blown to smithereens" there.
- AStonesThrow 1y agoPringles also contain corn, rice, and wheat. https://www.pringles.com/en-us/products/pringles-the-original-product.html https://www.pringles.com/en-us/products/pringles-the-origina... Lay's Classic contain only potatoes, currently with a grab-bag of oils: https://www.pepsicoproductfacts.com/Home/Product?formula=LBS000005404&form=RTE&size=8 https://www.pepsicoproductfacts.com/Home/Product?formula=LBS... The most "basic" mass-produced snack food award goes to: Fritos! https://www.pepsicoproductfacts.com/Home/product?formula=LBS000001474&form=RTE&size=9.25 https://www.pepsicoproductfacts.com/Home/product?formula=LBS... (US formulations only. Your gas station may vary.)
- schmidtleonard 1y ago"Not too much" and "mostly plants" are good, but trying to redefine food is a bit wacky, once you learn that that's his game. I'm not even against the idea that processed food is often bad and should always be treated with skepticism, but naturalism as a foundational principle is just way too exploitable. I called "companies are going to start marketing sugar as a natural alternative to low-calorie sweeteners" a decade before I saw it in grocery stores and I would like to pre-register my prediction that tobacco products will soon come back as "natural alternatives to vapes" in the not too distant future.
- testing22321 1y ago> trying to redefine food is a bit wacky No, it’s incredibly simple and makes sense. Coke are Doritos are not food, they are a science experiment designed for the express purpose of getting you hooked. They have virtually no health benefits and a ton of negatives. Nobody should ever put them into their body, or certainly as little as possible. Our “food” has changed more in 50 years than the preceding 500. Take away all the science experiments and eat what your great grandma did “mostly greens, not too much” and a massive number of health epidemics go away.
- dr_dshiv 1y agoMy 15 year old son is now taller than I am and most of his nutrition is not food. It’s horrid. I suspect this is why Dutch people are so tall. Mostly cheap processed food and hormones in the milk. Ymmv
- s_m_t 1y agoThe cognitive dissonance here is striking. A growing man needs a shit ton of calories to grow to their full potential. You might as well fill your caloric needs with "junk" food otherwise you will need to spend an inordinate amount of time preparing and eating "natural" food at a higher cost for the exact same effect.
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- oldpersonintx2 1y ago> "Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants." GLP-1 has freed Americans from the burden of thinking about what they eat. The drug dictates their appetite now, and any old junk will fill the shrunken void.
- chermi 1y agoI thought it helped with cravings/addictive behavior. Which is the opposite of you're saying, if we're all accepting in this post that processed foods are designed to work on cravings and are addictive.
- spondylosaurus 1y agoYou're correct; they definitely make you less inclined to crave "junk," and more likely to feel a bit ill after eating it.
- paulpauper 1y agonot really. even with GLP-1 drugs, many people are still obese or overweight. individual response to this drug is extremely variable.
- paulpauper 1y agoWhere people trip-up with plant-based diets is overdoing the butters, oils, humus, tofu, nuts, and legumes. Those things are often super calorie dense. You have to stick with mostly the leafy plants and keep oils and butters to a minimum.
- croisillon 1y agoyeah it's always funny how carnivorous need a lot of tiptoeing not to feel shamed for eating animals
- criddell 1y agoI think that’s covered by “The more steps involved between the soil and your mouth, the less "food" it is.” To me, that suggests they believe you should eat what the animal eats and skip eating the animal.
- croisillon 1y agonothing against my parent poster, it's just they mentioned "doesn't alienate anyone [...] or shame you for doing the wrong thing" which in my experience is necessary to get someone reasonable to think about their dietary habits
- mock-possum 1y agoIt’s my understanding that carnivores are pretty rare among human populations
- IAmBroom 1y agoTo be fair, they said "carnivorous", not "carnivores". Omnivores are carnivorous.
- dilap 1y ago> "Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants." Who's going to spread the good word to the Maasai?
- marbro 1y ago[dead]
- msla 1y ago[flagged]
- smugma 1y agofirst paragraph states the opposite: I was surprised to see Michael Pollan and Marion Nestle, two giants of food advocacy, take a clear stance in favor of genetically modified organisms, or GMOs, since the two have previously been critical of these controversial foods. The film, which purports to explore “the good, the bad and the ugly of genetic engineering,” is unusual in that it’s unabashedly pro-GMO, using science to debunk the myth that GMOs are harmful and portraying the activists who oppose them as the food-world equivalent of flat-earthers.
- msla 1y agoRead further: > Pollan, for his part, signed a letter with a group of fellow academics (including Nestle) on June 16 to protest UC Berkeley’s screening of the film (let’s pause here to note: they are protesting the mere fact that this film was even shown). Those who signed the letter attested that the movie was nothing more than an advertisement for GMOs, and said it “marginalizes the lived experiences of farmers and eaters.”
- muchosandwich 1y agoSeems like he has a problem with the final edit of the movie and not anything specific about GMO. This is a growing problem with documentaries where the filmmakers claim a certain angle to get people to participate but reveal a corporate angle in the edit. This is his actual position (source: https://michaelpollan.com/articles-archive/vote-for-the-dinner-party/ https://michaelpollan.com/articles-archive/vote-for-the-dinn... 2012) > Americans have been eating genetically engineered food for 18 years, and as supporters of the technology are quick to point out, we don’t seem to be dropping like flies. But they miss the point. The fight over labeling G.M. food is not foremost about food safety or environmental harm, legitimate though these questions are. The fight is about the power of Big Food. Monsanto has become the symbol of everything people dislike about industrial agriculture: corporate control of the regulatory process; lack of transparency (for consumers) and lack of choice (for farmers); an intensifying rain of pesticides on ever-expanding monocultures; and the monopolization of seeds, which is to say, of the genetic resources on which all of humanity depends. Largely he's been proven correct as GMO crops from Monsanto have has negative biological, legal and financial consequences on neighboring crops and water supplies. https://cases.open.ubc.ca/monsanto-and-terminator-seeds/#:~:text=Monsanto%20and%20Terminator%20Seeds%20Monsanto,many%20GMOs%20into%20the%20earth. https://cases.open.ubc.ca/monsanto-and-terminator-seeds/#:~:... GMO crops from other sources don't have the same problems.
- pramodbiligiri 1y agoPast thread from 8 years ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13487886 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13487886 (179 comments)
- dang 1y agoThanks! Macroexpanded: Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants. (2007) - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13487886 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13487886 - Jan 2017 (179 comments)
- runamuck 1y agoAt lunch I drink a plant based protein shake. I noticed that it stops the binge cravings I used to have at night. I lost 43 pounds since last June.
- m4rc3lv 1y agoNice! I've been WFPB all my life :-)
- drjasonharrison 1y agoLucky duck!
- ge96 1y agoI decided I'm going to switch to a salad+meat diet will see how that goes. Been enjoying these pre-made caesar salads at work.
- bdbenton5255 1y agoI personally prefer an animal-based diet revolving around meat and milk. It is conducive to strength training and fits my taste buds, but I always incorporate fruits and vegetables to secure vitamins and minerals. The essential nutrients that your body needs are carbohydrates, protein, lipids, vitamins, minerals, fiber, and water. The first three are macronutrients, providing most of your body's energy in the form of calories. Traditional diets incorporate all of these nutrients naturally, as human beings formed traditional diets by sourcing needed nutrients from the surrounding environment. Before industrialization, humanity subsisted on these diets, and if you look far back enough you will find these foodways in your ancestral culture. Industrialization provides us the luxury of choice in our diets, but it also leaves many displaced and confused as to choosing a diet. You will find that traditional dishes naturally incorporate all of our necessary nutrients. A good rule of thumb when building healthy meals is this: Carb + protein + vitamins/minerals Such as: Rice + beans + tomato + onions Potatoes + steak + green beans + milk And so on. The carbohydrates and proteins will provide the bulk of your calories and the feeling of "fullness" while the sources of vitamins and minerals will complete your diet. A good metaphor is to think of the human body like a car that needs gasoline and oil primarily as well as some additional fluids to run optimally. A balanced diet will help you feel better physically and psychologically. Whether you choose to source protein from plants or animals is entirely up to your discretion in this industrialized age, while it was previously a result of an agricultural or pastoral means of subsistence.
- andrewla 1y ago> The essential nutrients that your body needs are The article has an extensive discussion as to why this way of phrasing the problem is not only meaningless but actively harmful. That's not to say your diet is necessarily bad; frankly by adhering to his "eat food, not too much" you're 2/3 of the way to what Pollan recommends. You're only missing "mostly plants", but you're doing better from his rubric than a diet consisting of mostly processed food products.
- bdbenton5255 1y agoRight, I just disagree with the author as nutrition is more complex than what he posited. Following his advice, you will not acquire sufficient nutrients to do things like build muscle.
- tunesmith 1y agoIt's just still so complicated when you are dealing with any level of digestive issues. Sometimes you're supposed to lay off high-fiber fruits like apples. And then there's soluble versus insoluble fibers (sometimes you need more insoluble), gut flora, probiotics; fats are both good and bad for gut "motility"... if your balance is off somehow it just gets really complicated really fast.
- Aziell 1y agoThat line "Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants." really hit me. Sometimes when I go shopping, I catch myself checking fat and sugar first, then looking for added omega-3. The more I read, the more complicated eating seems to become. I keep staring at nutrition labels, and end up feeling more confused about what I should actually eat.
- brian_spiering 1y agoOne heuristic is to choose foods without nutrition labels.
- Jensson 1y agoDoesn't all food have nutrition labels? We know the nutrients of potatoes and apples and vegetables, so there are labels for them.
- bob1029 1y agoI have made an interesting discovery recently. The type of media I use for frying up taco shells has a dramatic impact on my consumption rate. When fried in vegetable oil, I tend to eat 4-5. When fried in lard, 2 is starting to feel a bit much. The animal fat option seems to be what my body prefers. There's clearly some kind of endogenous GLP-1 inhibition action going on. It sticks with me a lot longer too. I feel myself getting sucked into my work for hours on end instead of bouncing in and out of the kitchen every 30 minutes looking for a snack. I think "mostly plants" can be interpreted as malicious advice given the realities of human biology.