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You can absolutely raise taxes on the wealthy and close loopholes (we should do those things) but it's not gonna fix the massive hole that is social spending in

You can absolutely raise taxes on the wealthy and close loopholes (we should do those things) but it's not gonna fix the massive hole that is social spending in the budget of nearly every western nation. It's more structural than that.

samus 1y ago
The loopholes just make it easier to funnel money away from the taxman. It's still possible due to how capitalism works and not fixable unless we go for something equivalent to nationalizing big companies.
- scotty79 1y ago
  You could mandate that money transfers go through banks and tax the transfers. Let's see how rich can get richer without transferring their money.
  - toomuchtodo 1y ago
    You can also tax where the asset ownership is recorded. Property records, securities records, etc. If it isn’t recorded with a public body where taxes can be assessed, it isn’t recognized. Wealth must exist on the books somewhere.
    - scotty79 1y ago
      Yes, there are ways to tax the rich. We aren't doing it because those who decide about such things are the rich.
    - samus 1y ago
      This assumes that there is only a single country on Earth or that the rich would not be willing to move to a country with lower taxation. Hint: they are already doing that.
      - scotty79 1y ago
        right, because what will really improve their business is moving to a country with less and poorer consumers, they could extract money from also .. what's bad about the rich moving out? you can always print more money to balance out the money they've taken away and companies and properties that they used to owned are gonna be sold to some new people who are not that rich yet
        samus 1y ago
        Cranking up the taxes will just make life more expensive for everyone. And printing more money is a terrible solution to financial problems.
        scotty79 1y ago
        Letting wealth of the rich grow so much faster than the growth of the economy is so much worse, because it means that the rich are increasingly draining poor of their resoruces.
        samus 1y ago
        Debasing the currency has the same effect, as it is equivalent to a flat tax, which hits lower income brackets harder than the wealthy.
  - samus 1y ago
    That has the same impact as other, similarly radical solutions. In the best case the rich will just remove as much of their property from the country as possible. They might keep a villa or two, some cars, and some pocket money, but the majority of their income will be out of reach of the taxman. Or they might just rent everything they need from a local branch of a company and pay a branch in another country, and the two interact via crypto. Or indirectly via remittances as there will be a market for asking low-income people to transfer money on behalf of rich people, as transactions of low-income people would probably not be taxed.

samus 1y ago

The loopholes just make it easier to funnel money away from the taxman. It's still possible due to how capitalism works and not fixable unless we go for something equivalent to nationalizing big companies.

scotty79 1y ago
You could mandate that money transfers go through banks and tax the transfers. Let's see how rich can get richer without transferring their money.
- toomuchtodo 1y ago
  You can also tax where the asset ownership is recorded. Property records, securities records, etc. If it isn’t recorded with a public body where taxes can be assessed, it isn’t recognized. Wealth must exist on the books somewhere.
  - scotty79 1y ago
    Yes, there are ways to tax the rich. We aren't doing it because those who decide about such things are the rich.
  - samus 1y ago
    This assumes that there is only a single country on Earth or that the rich would not be willing to move to a country with lower taxation. Hint: they are already doing that.
    - scotty79 1y ago
      right, because what will really improve their business is moving to a country with less and poorer consumers, they could extract money from also .. what's bad about the rich moving out? you can always print more money to balance out the money they've taken away and companies and properties that they used to owned are gonna be sold to some new people who are not that rich yet
      - samus 1y ago
        Cranking up the taxes will just make life more expensive for everyone. And printing more money is a terrible solution to financial problems.
        scotty79 1y ago
        Letting wealth of the rich grow so much faster than the growth of the economy is so much worse, because it means that the rich are increasingly draining poor of their resoruces.
        samus 1y ago
        Debasing the currency has the same effect, as it is equivalent to a flat tax, which hits lower income brackets harder than the wealthy.
- samus 1y ago
  That has the same impact as other, similarly radical solutions. In the best case the rich will just remove as much of their property from the country as possible. They might keep a villa or two, some cars, and some pocket money, but the majority of their income will be out of reach of the taxman. Or they might just rent everything they need from a local branch of a company and pay a branch in another country, and the two interact via crypto. Or indirectly via remittances as there will be a market for asking low-income people to transfer money on behalf of rich people, as transactions of low-income people would probably not be taxed.