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Is it unpopular? I grew up in Alberta and know many people who would be happy to separate, going back to my step dad way back in the 90s. Plenty of Albertans al

Is it unpopular? I grew up in Alberta and know many people who would be happy to separate, going back to my step dad way back in the 90s. Plenty of Albertans also still hold a grudge for the National Energy Program[1] that bankrupted them in the 80s. At the very least, many Albertan's perceive Queubec separatism as a negotiating tactic that allowed Quebec to secure preferential treatment from Ottawa and would be willing to try the same approach. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Energy_Program https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Energy_Program

SketchySeaBeast 1y ago
Yes, it's unpopular. There've been no polls that indicate it would have any chance of passing if it came down to a vote. A lot of Albertans love to grumble.
- BJones12 1y ago
  That's like saying Bernie was unpopular because he couldn't win the primary. He was very popular.
  - jszymborski 1y ago
    No, that's like saying Bernie was unpopular because polls of his popularity said he was unpopular.
  - nonchalantsui 1y ago
    That's not at all similar. We know exactly how many voted for Bernie. The only actual test of separatism in albert has been support for the pension plan and that has been so abysmal they've put the entire push on hold.
- tenpies 1y ago
  Polls were also showing the Liberals would be wiped out - possibly not even the opposition party - and Conservatives would form a super majority. Which is why it's important to remember that polls are a moment in time and the circumstances of that moment. One divisive comment from Carney or his cabinet. One Trump truth. One more set of tariffs. That's all it takes for a 20% swing in polling that already shows that shows that 36% of Albertans are for leaving[1]. Also worth adding that everyone is sleeping on Saskatchewan which is crucially important to Canada, even more ignored by the Liberals than Alberta, and just as likely to leave. Saskatchewan is also suffering China's tariffs on Canada, which Carney has not ever responded to and ignores almost as much as he ignores Saskatchewan itself[2]. [1] https://angusreid.org/referendum-alberta-saskatchewan-smith-moe/ https://angusreid.org/referendum-alberta-saskatchewan-smith-... [2] https://www.rbc.com/en/thought-leadership/the-trade-hub/food-fight-chinas-tariffs-adds-to-exporters-woes https://www.rbc.com/en/thought-leadership/the-trade-hub/food...
BJones12 1y ago
As someone who grew up in Ontario, I judge this comment to be 100% accurate.
hbsbsbsndk 1y ago
I think it's a "fuck around and find out" situation like Brexit. People love to stomp their feet and complain, but when some big interest group actually organizes the vote and it happens they'll be caught unawares. People complain about have/have-not provinces, but Alberta would be in a much worse position as a independent nation. There are benefits to Confederation beyond just shuffling tax dollars around.
- aylmao 1y ago
  This certainly sounds to me more like a Texas situation. Independent for about a year, to then join the USA.
- Alupis 1y ago
  As an outsider with no horse in the race, and pays little attention to domestic affairs of foreign nations - has Brexit actually been that awful for people? For all of the doomsday talk, hand-wringing, and sky-is-falling bluster, nothing substantial/consequential seems to have materialized.
  - kergonath 1y ago
    > For all of the doomsday talk, hand-wringing, and sky-is-falling bluster You have to be careful about these arguments. A lot of them were post-fact rationalisation by Brexiteers who needed to justify their actions, and they did it by erecting strawmen. Nobody said that the sky would be falling. Nobody sane, anyway. What was said was things like “immigration will happen anyway because the UK has a structural need for manpower”, which is true and immigration is still increasing; “this will create more red tape rather than less”, which it did; “exports will fall and it is our major market”, which they did and it still is; and so on. If you read actual prospective papers from the time, the warnings were true, give or take the massive spanner in the works that was Covid. The EU did not roll over, and the UK did not get access to the single market without costs. The UK was sidelined and just spent 10 years cap in hand trying to get free trade deals. Fishermen are not better off, far from it. Environment regulations did get to shit. The cost in terms of GDP was massive. Poverty did rise (although it was bound to rise anyway with pre-Brexit policies). If the whole thing is not a massive self-inflicted shot in the feet, I don’t know what is.

SketchySeaBeast 1y ago

Yes, it's unpopular. There've been no polls that indicate it would have any chance of passing if it came down to a vote. A lot of Albertans love to grumble.

BJones12 1y ago
That's like saying Bernie was unpopular because he couldn't win the primary. He was very popular.
- jszymborski 1y ago
  No, that's like saying Bernie was unpopular because polls of his popularity said he was unpopular.
- nonchalantsui 1y ago
  That's not at all similar. We know exactly how many voted for Bernie. The only actual test of separatism in albert has been support for the pension plan and that has been so abysmal they've put the entire push on hold.
tenpies 1y ago
Polls were also showing the Liberals would be wiped out - possibly not even the opposition party - and Conservatives would form a super majority. Which is why it's important to remember that polls are a moment in time and the circumstances of that moment. One divisive comment from Carney or his cabinet. One Trump truth. One more set of tariffs. That's all it takes for a 20% swing in polling that already shows that shows that 36% of Albertans are for leaving[1]. Also worth adding that everyone is sleeping on Saskatchewan which is crucially important to Canada, even more ignored by the Liberals than Alberta, and just as likely to leave. Saskatchewan is also suffering China's tariffs on Canada, which Carney has not ever responded to and ignores almost as much as he ignores Saskatchewan itself[2]. [1] https://angusreid.org/referendum-alberta-saskatchewan-smith-moe/ https://angusreid.org/referendum-alberta-saskatchewan-smith-... [2] https://www.rbc.com/en/thought-leadership/the-trade-hub/food-fight-chinas-tariffs-adds-to-exporters-woes https://www.rbc.com/en/thought-leadership/the-trade-hub/food...

BJones12 1y ago

As someone who grew up in Ontario, I judge this comment to be 100% accurate.

hbsbsbsndk 1y ago

I think it's a "fuck around and find out" situation like Brexit. People love to stomp their feet and complain, but when some big interest group actually organizes the vote and it happens they'll be caught unawares. People complain about have/have-not provinces, but Alberta would be in a much worse position as a independent nation. There are benefits to Confederation beyond just shuffling tax dollars around.

aylmao 1y ago
This certainly sounds to me more like a Texas situation. Independent for about a year, to then join the USA.
Alupis 1y ago
As an outsider with no horse in the race, and pays little attention to domestic affairs of foreign nations - has Brexit actually been that awful for people? For all of the doomsday talk, hand-wringing, and sky-is-falling bluster, nothing substantial/consequential seems to have materialized.
- kergonath 1y ago
  > For all of the doomsday talk, hand-wringing, and sky-is-falling bluster You have to be careful about these arguments. A lot of them were post-fact rationalisation by Brexiteers who needed to justify their actions, and they did it by erecting strawmen. Nobody said that the sky would be falling. Nobody sane, anyway. What was said was things like “immigration will happen anyway because the UK has a structural need for manpower”, which is true and immigration is still increasing; “this will create more red tape rather than less”, which it did; “exports will fall and it is our major market”, which they did and it still is; and so on. If you read actual prospective papers from the time, the warnings were true, give or take the massive spanner in the works that was Covid. The EU did not roll over, and the UK did not get access to the single market without costs. The UK was sidelined and just spent 10 years cap in hand trying to get free trade deals. Fishermen are not better off, far from it. Environment regulations did get to shit. The cost in terms of GDP was massive. Poverty did rise (although it was bound to rise anyway with pre-Brexit policies). If the whole thing is not a massive self-inflicted shot in the feet, I don’t know what is.