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Honestly, I think there are no "best practices" here, there's simply "patterns I've seen work before". If we put people over processes, you might actually find

Honestly, I think there are no "best practices" here, there's simply "patterns I've seen work before". If we put people over processes, you might actually find you can manage a much bigger org. Like if the standup is really killing large parts of the week, you might find killing the standup to be the preferable option. The fact that that's sacrilege and constantly evokes the no true Scotsman tells you all you need to know about people over processes.

ivan_gammel 1y ago
>Honestly, I think there are no "best practices" here, there's simply "patterns I've seen work before" I have been working in the industry for more than 25 years and in many very different companies, even different cultures. Yes, that may be my own experience. I have been in continuous exchange with my colleagues in a big network of European CTOs and I validated it enough to say, that it can be considered a best practice. What it makes different from a law of nature is that best practices do not always work in every possible situation, but they are expected to work in similar environments. >If we put people over processes... Do not forget the second part of the sentence in my comment. Processes must exist - you cannot eliminate something that serves some real need and expect things to get better. By reducing number of meetings you cannot make management job easier or scale it to a bigger team, on the contrary, you will be doing a shitty job. The sole purpose of a manager is to be an oil in the engine, to facilitate the efficient process, and that includes information exchange and empathetic connections. Not to code, not to move tickets, not to write down the requirements. To talk. If people do not talk, do not engage with each other, you fail at that, because the social fabric of the team will rot. Everyone in the team and in the company has their own agenda and their own goals. If they are not aligned continuously, all sorts of toxic environments may emerge. >Like if the standup is really killing large parts of the week, you might find killing the standup to be the preferable option 15 minute meeting cannot kill large parts of the week by the definition of time measurement units. It's 3.5% or less, depending on how long is your working week. If this meeting takes more, the solution is to stick to the time frame, not to cancel.
- nuancebydefault 1y ago
  I've been in the software engineering industry for almost 30 years and my take is there are no 'best' practices, only 'fit' practices, as the article articulates so nicely. So many times I've seen processes and organizational structures change, each time imposing it's for the better. It's not converging to something 'better'.
  - ivan_gammel 1y ago
    It is a matter of word definitions, really. E.g. a team may call a "best practice" something that they repeatedly mention as "keep doing" on a retrospective and maintain the list of them. It's just what works well and what's reproducible and not something to be canonized in a holy book.
  - foobarian 1y ago
    One may call it a "best practice," another may call it "fit practice," but at the end of the day I have no doubt that were Ivan to step in to lead our org it would change for the better :-). As they say there is no arguing with working code
- ownagefool 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - ivan_gammel 1y ago
    >I mean sure, but that's not evidence of best practice with any sort of rigor around measurable outcomes. Of course, it is not. I doubt that there exist many management practices that were measurably proven to be effective. It's just an explanation why I perceive those as best practices. They have worked for me and my peers in a reproducible way. >my suggestion that there's other successful ways to run a team >Learn to deal with dissenting opinion Please elaborate on your dissenting opinion and try to avoid personal attacks. What are those ways?
    - ownagefool 1y ago

ivan_gammel 1y ago

>Honestly, I think there are no "best practices" here, there's simply "patterns I've seen work before" I have been working in the industry for more than 25 years and in many very different companies, even different cultures. Yes, that may be my own experience. I have been in continuous exchange with my colleagues in a big network of European CTOs and I validated it enough to say, that it can be considered a best practice. What it makes different from a law of nature is that best practices do not always work in every possible situation, but they are expected to work in similar environments. >If we put people over processes... Do not forget the second part of the sentence in my comment. Processes must exist - you cannot eliminate something that serves some real need and expect things to get better. By reducing number of meetings you cannot make management job easier or scale it to a bigger team, on the contrary, you will be doing a shitty job. The sole purpose of a manager is to be an oil in the engine, to facilitate the efficient process, and that includes information exchange and empathetic connections. Not to code, not to move tickets, not to write down the requirements. To talk. If people do not talk, do not engage with each other, you fail at that, because the social fabric of the team will rot. Everyone in the team and in the company has their own agenda and their own goals. If they are not aligned continuously, all sorts of toxic environments may emerge. >Like if the standup is really killing large parts of the week, you might find killing the standup to be the preferable option 15 minute meeting cannot kill large parts of the week by the definition of time measurement units. It's 3.5% or less, depending on how long is your working week. If this meeting takes more, the solution is to stick to the time frame, not to cancel.

nuancebydefault 1y ago
I've been in the software engineering industry for almost 30 years and my take is there are no 'best' practices, only 'fit' practices, as the article articulates so nicely. So many times I've seen processes and organizational structures change, each time imposing it's for the better. It's not converging to something 'better'.
- ivan_gammel 1y ago
  It is a matter of word definitions, really. E.g. a team may call a "best practice" something that they repeatedly mention as "keep doing" on a retrospective and maintain the list of them. It's just what works well and what's reproducible and not something to be canonized in a holy book.
- foobarian 1y ago
  One may call it a "best practice," another may call it "fit practice," but at the end of the day I have no doubt that were Ivan to step in to lead our org it would change for the better :-). As they say there is no arguing with working code
ownagefool 1y ago
[flagged]
- ivan_gammel 1y ago
  >I mean sure, but that's not evidence of best practice with any sort of rigor around measurable outcomes. Of course, it is not. I doubt that there exist many management practices that were measurably proven to be effective. It's just an explanation why I perceive those as best practices. They have worked for me and my peers in a reproducible way. >my suggestion that there's other successful ways to run a team >Learn to deal with dissenting opinion Please elaborate on your dissenting opinion and try to avoid personal attacks. What are those ways?
  - ownagefool 1y ago