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Student loans generally don't wait, and most people wail while they're working the shitty jobs.
by Loudergood 1y ago
Student loans generally don't wait, and most people wail while they're working the shitty jobs.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoWhy is why one shouldn’t take on large amounts of debt for questionable return.
- michaelmrose 1y agoWhat should they do then?
- tekla 1y agoGet good grades and scholarships
- lotsofpulp 1y agoGovernment funded schools with lower tuition (possibly even community college), more rigorous degrees with higher likelihoods of stable pay (e.g. medical/engineering), trade schools/apprenticeships.
- eyesofgod 1y ago[dead]
- dttze 1y agoThey did that. Then those jobs still went away. So fuck them, right?
- lotsofpulp 1y agoThat’s why you choose lower tuition options so debt levels are manageable even with jobs that pay less.
- dttze 1y agoYou started by saying people shouldn't take on large amounts of debt for questionable return. Now you are saying they should take on medium amounts of debt for questionable return. All while ignoring the questionable return part.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoI do not see how I am ignoring the questionable return part. There is lots of data on which educational investments result in more stable cash flow vs less stable cash flow. These same conversations were being had 20+ years ago when I was in college. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_basket_weaving https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_basket_weaving Technically, the term wasn't about money at the beginning, but I think by the 1990s and 2000s, when people started borrowing tens of thousands of dollars per year from federal taxpayers, it became more about the ROI.
- dttze 1y ago> There is lots of data on which educational investments result in more stable cash flow vs less stable cash flow. The whole point of the comment you replied to was that this data is now wrong, as capital has continued to rug pull industries however it benefits them. So, once again, people can analyze all the data and make the "correct" decision and then still wind up in 40k of debt and no good job prospects.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoYes, but $40k of debt amortized over 20 years is not disabling. Plenty of jobs, even towards the lowest wages offered in most metros (which is $15+) can still allow for one to make progress. The point is going $160k in debt at a private or out of state school can disable you.
- michaelmrose 1y agoIf you have 40k in debt and a $15 an hour job AND the expense of living in the a city you are well and truly fucked. Forgive me for using the first link off google but using this it says it would take approx 20 years paying $300 a month to pay off $40k. https://www.calculator.net/debt-payoff-calculator.html https://www.calculator.net/debt-payoff-calculator.html You will have to somehow live on the remaining $1700 you take home after taxes and loan payment in cities where the rent for really shitty studios is about that and they want you to make 3x the rent to live indoors. It's possible that you like most people who are living off much more than the minimum have no idea how ridiculously hard it is at the bottom.
- red-iron-pine 1y ago> more rigorous degrees with higher likelihoods of stable pay (e.g. medical/engineering) this is the dumbest thing ever. first off, they already chased degrees that paid better -- they went STEM. secondly, things change a lot in 4 years. the 2020 college freshman is now getting screwed for choosing STEM right now, today. 4 years ago it was a good choice, 2 years ago it was shaky, and now it's a mess. medicine is also certainly not a solution, as programs are extremely competitive and take 8+ years to complete from undergrad through residency. and not all medical fields are magically lucrative or in demand.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoNot all STEM are equal. I would be surprised if significant numbers of electrical/chemical/civil/mechanical engineers are unemployed. But the more important thing is if tuition and other expenses are low (which they are if one goes to state school or community college for first 2 years), then even a different job can provide enough income to service debt.
- schnitzelstoat 1y agoMedicine pays so well because it has a medieval guild-like structure which controls the numbers of who can enter the profession.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoThe barrier to entry for nursing/PA/NP pretty low.
- dttze 1y agoNo it isn't. PA is way more work than a NP too, and this varies a ton by location. You're just talking out of your ass.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoWhy are the relative difficulties relevant? Either way, those career options offer stable, recurring cash flow of at least 50th percentile income, with PA offering even more.
- justaj 1y agoBecoming self-taught? Currently I'm learning POSIX shell scripting and installing OpenBSD and FreeBSD in my local VMs on the weekends, and since AI is helping me, I'm able to gain 3 to 4 times more experience than I would otherwise have gained. All of those skills might come in handy in the future.
- schnitzelstoat 1y agoAlmost all professional jobs require a college degree to even be considered though. I'm sure there are exceptions, but the general rule is clear.
- lotsofpulp 1y agoElectricians/plumbers/welders/landscapers/cleaners etc are also professionals. Unless we are using professional to mean some kind of socioeconomic class signifier.
- justaj 1y agoIsn't it a bit different in the field of software? Weren't most of the top senior devs actually self-taught?
- otikik 1y agoStudy abroad. Europe has very good public universities