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Ive is a good designer sure but "essentially created the iPhone" is absurd. It took thousands of engineers and product visionaries to bring that device together
by paxys 1y ago
Ive is a good designer sure but "essentially created the iPhone" is absurd. It took thousands of engineers and product visionaries to bring that device together, and OpenAI isn't getting any of that. You aren't going to replicate its success by hiring the guy whose major contribution was insisisting that all Apple products be a few millimeters thinner in every iteration.
- woah 1y agoLots of companies were making smart phones with similar specs. Under Johnny Ive's management, the Apple version made a much bigger splash than any of them and defined the category.
- timschmidt 1y agoArguably HP/Palm's WebOS devices were ahead on every mark - easier to use, more featureful, smarter, better physical design than any iPhone of similar manufacturing date. The difference was management choosing to stick with a platform for long enough for network effects to kick in. If Apple has any advantages compared to other big tech, it's an ability to look past next quarter's financials.
- waffletower 1y agoPalm offerings in 2007, such as the Treo 755p or the Centro, could not compete hardware-wise with the original iPhone. The claim that these Palm phones were "easier to use" is hilarious to me, and probably hilarious to many others.
- timschmidt 1y agoI explicitly mentioned WebOS, meaning the devices released around 2009, which competed with 1st gen iPhone old stock, and directly against iPhone 3G - the second generation. The first gen iPhone is not a smartphone by today's standards. No multitasking, no copy/paste, no centralized instant messaging, all things WebOS devices had on release. Even the second generation of iPhones felt half baked by comparison. Which just goes to illustrate my point, that they weren't technologically superior, just more committed.
- paxys 1y agoThe race was already over by the time webOS showed up. Even Microsoft, with a superior product and many billions spent pushing it, couldn't overcome the network effects of iOS and Android. No one else had a chance.
- timschmidt 1y agoDisagree strongly. Your definition of failure seems to be "not achieving market monopoly" which doesn't make any sense to me. Both Microsoft phones and WebOS have surviving communities today, and would have thriving communities if new devices were available. Sadly, it takes more than two consecutive quarters to establish a platform.
- paxys 1y agoMy definition for success is - do they still exist
- timschmidt 1y agoComcast and AT&T still exist. Kraft still turns out war rations by the warehouse. Tasteless grocery store tomatoes are still the most widely available. This metric has very little to do with quality.
- marnett 1y agoThose are horrible examples. The product lines you are discussing do not exist in any meaningful sense of the term.
- timschmidt 1y agoLuneOS - the direct continuation of WebOS development had a release in Feb 2024 and is still under active development: https://webos-ports.org/wiki/Main_Page https://webos-ports.org/wiki/Main_Page Pretty good for something that supposedly failed 12 years ago.
- paxys 1y ago> Under Johnny Ive's management You spelled Steve Jobs wrong.
- waffletower 1y agoAt the time of the public debut of the first generation iPhone (January 2007), the statement "lots of companies were making smart phones with similar specs" is objectively false. Further, there were zero companies making comparable large touchscreen, large cpu phones outside of Apple at the time.
- brentm 1y agoYou're 100% right and in my opinion there is a much higher probability this is a total waste and nothing of similar value will be created. But if you're OpenAI and you have this option I also see why you may take it.
- rogerkirkness 1y agoThe book 'The One Device' covers this in really thorough detail.
- etempleton 1y agoCompletely agree. He is a good designer, but graphical UX went downhill when he was given more control at Apple and he became increasingly militant about hardware design to the point that the MacBook Pro was kinda bad because it was unreasonably thermal limited and had a terrible keyboard.
- bmurphy1976 1y agoKinda bad is quite the understatement.
- mortenjorck 1y agoIve is basically the best in the business if your needs are to get a large amount of cutting-edge technology into a ridiculously constrained form factor and have it look good, feel solid, and be manufacturable at scale. That is what he is world-class at. Not designing comprehensive product experiences or ideating new greenfield products (and definitely not designing app icons). If IO or OpenAI also has a product visionary of the caliber to fully utilize Ive's singular industrial design talent, they'll rule the world. Otherwise, they're sinking billions into the next Humane Pin.
- enneff 1y agoI don’t think there’s any evidence that Ive has the expertise you claim. He was lead designer for Apple when they did the iPhone, but it is Apple who has the extensive deep expertise in hardware design and engineering.
- rhubarbtree 1y agoIve spent months in China working on the iPhone assembly. Plenty of evidence.
- fidotron 1y agoThe team on the iPhone was surprisingly small. Not small by startup standards, but nothing like as big as many would imagine.