4 ms·

Forced to DRM for security... And people will still argue that Windows (and I will generalize to "Microsoft products") is not evil?! Come on guys, come on...

k__ 1y ago
What would be the alternative? Build your whole machine at home?
- weird_trousers 1y ago
  Is it a joke? There are multiple alternatives, for Microsoft Windows or other Microsoft products like Office or Azure.
  - k__ 1y ago
    So, trusting someone else is a solution?
    - dsr_ 1y ago
      Trusting something you can verify is a solution.
      - k__ 1y ago
        Which DRM solutions like TEE and FHE are, so I don't see the issue.
        debugnik 1y ago
        The "DRM" used here by Signal is just a Win32 function that keeps a window out of screen capture, not an anti-tamper software nor a protected media path.
        k__ 1y ago
        Fair. But it seems to me that's a step in the right direction, even if it doesn't go far enough.
    - WD-42 1y ago
      Yes? Isn't that how trust works? You stop trusting those that don't deserve it. Unless you're a complete isolationist and/or sociopath living off the land in the woods, you need some level of trust in others.
    - Groxx 1y ago
      The tradeoff here is "do you want to trust this repeat abuser again, or trust someone else who has not been [as] abusive?", not "do you want to trust this repeat abuser again, or nobody ever again?" You're presenting an extreme example of a false dichotomy.
      - k__ 1y ago
        I don't see MS as the problem, but the structure of how we, as a society, create and use IT. Signal uses DRM to protect its users from the OS. This is nice, because now they don't have to run to some other companies that could do the same thing.
    - caned 1y ago
      In such a case as this, yes. Not every systems product is designed to exfiltrate your data.
- BriggyDwiggs42 1y ago
  Linux is the most obvious
  - k__ 1y ago
    On the hardware you build yourself? I don't think so. The OS and the hardware become irrelevant when you run your apps behind DRM. At least one thing we can thank the copyright trolls for.
    - hedora 1y ago
      I bought an AMD mini-PC. It came with windows 11, but I just yanked that NVMe drive out, and installed Linux on it. Linux support for such devices is excellent because they're basically down to just one SoC package that's been tested by AMD. This one also has an Intel Wifi/Bluetooth chip, which is exactly as flaky as any other Intel product would be with any other OS. Anyway, there are options to disable TPM in the BIOS if you care, but I don't think any of the DRM stuff works by default.
    - BriggyDwiggs42 1y ago
      I’m very confused. You know what DRM is right? I’m not trying to insult you, but I feel like we’re working with different definitions or something.

k__ 1y ago

What would be the alternative? Build your whole machine at home?

weird_trousers 1y ago
Is it a joke? There are multiple alternatives, for Microsoft Windows or other Microsoft products like Office or Azure.
- k__ 1y ago
  So, trusting someone else is a solution?
  - dsr_ 1y ago
    Trusting something you can verify is a solution.
    - k__ 1y ago
      Which DRM solutions like TEE and FHE are, so I don't see the issue.
      - debugnik 1y ago
        The "DRM" used here by Signal is just a Win32 function that keeps a window out of screen capture, not an anti-tamper software nor a protected media path.
        k__ 1y ago
        Fair. But it seems to me that's a step in the right direction, even if it doesn't go far enough.
  - WD-42 1y ago
    Yes? Isn't that how trust works? You stop trusting those that don't deserve it. Unless you're a complete isolationist and/or sociopath living off the land in the woods, you need some level of trust in others.
  - Groxx 1y ago
    The tradeoff here is "do you want to trust this repeat abuser again, or trust someone else who has not been [as] abusive?", not "do you want to trust this repeat abuser again, or nobody ever again?" You're presenting an extreme example of a false dichotomy.
    - k__ 1y ago
      I don't see MS as the problem, but the structure of how we, as a society, create and use IT. Signal uses DRM to protect its users from the OS. This is nice, because now they don't have to run to some other companies that could do the same thing.
  - caned 1y ago
    In such a case as this, yes. Not every systems product is designed to exfiltrate your data.
BriggyDwiggs42 1y ago
Linux is the most obvious
- k__ 1y ago
  On the hardware you build yourself? I don't think so. The OS and the hardware become irrelevant when you run your apps behind DRM. At least one thing we can thank the copyright trolls for.
  - hedora 1y ago
    I bought an AMD mini-PC. It came with windows 11, but I just yanked that NVMe drive out, and installed Linux on it. Linux support for such devices is excellent because they're basically down to just one SoC package that's been tested by AMD. This one also has an Intel Wifi/Bluetooth chip, which is exactly as flaky as any other Intel product would be with any other OS. Anyway, there are options to disable TPM in the BIOS if you care, but I don't think any of the DRM stuff works by default.
  - BriggyDwiggs42 1y ago
    I’m very confused. You know what DRM is right? I’m not trying to insult you, but I feel like we’re working with different definitions or something.