4 ms·

> I'd classify this as a "gray area" So, sending one newsletter to a tiny group is considered a gray area. I'm just curious, what do you think about massive a

> I'd classify this as a "gray area" So, sending one newsletter to a tiny group is considered a gray area. I'm just curious, what do you think about massive advertising campaign for the German duo that run basically day and night for about a week on every major TV channel in Germany?

xg15 1y ago
I don't think the list is that tiny. Countries cannot vote for themselves, so whatever a broadcaster does in its own country isn't relevant to the votes. (And obviously every country hypes their own candidate as much as possible to their own audience. So does Israel. That's not a problem) I'd also see it as mostly OK if some country wanted to run a standard promo/advertising campaign for their candidate in other voting countries. A bit desperate, yes, but at least the campaign would be obvious to the public and would essentially just raise interest for the candidate's performance at the contest. Where I think it gets potentially deceptive is if you call up people to vote who are not even planning to watch the contest, do so with a clear political motivation - and then later pretend all the votes were organic. (Just checked the group's mails again. Interestingly, their call last year sounded a lot more urgent and openly political. "set an example", "every vote counts", with remarks that you can vote up to 20 times per device. This time the wording was much softer: "we wish her good luck and invite you to vote for her", with no mention of the 20 votes ability. Make of that what you want. Maybe someone complained.)
- CLPadvocate 1y ago
  Let's just agree that you're pretty biased. Israel runs no campaigns in Germany, the German-Israeli-Society is a German organisation, with mostly Germans as members, supported by the German Ministry of Foreign Affairs and having members of German Parliament as Directors. So, let's assume, it's run according to the highest standards regarding political correctness in Germany. But as you may remember, German television specifically targeted Germans on vacation in Spain (specifically Mallorca) and also Germans living close to the borders to vote for Germany from abroad on multiple occasions in the last years, which can be considered voter fraud without any grey areas. On the other hand, you didn't join the German-British-Society or the German-Swedish-Society or any other society to check if they behave according to your self-defined standards, so I would say, you need to check your own moral compass.
  - xg15 1y ago
    Go through the DIG's press releases throughout the war. Their position almost exactly tracks the official position of the Netanyahu government, wrapped in some pseudo-progressive rhetoric (with one(!) notable exception where they criticized Smotrich for planning to officially annex the West Bank). Their positions are also more extreme than even the official German position, e.g. demanding Egypt to accept forced displacement of Gazans into Sinai and all but rejecting the two-state solution. They agitate against any and all groups that dare to show a Palestinian perspective, even established German antifascist groups like Arsch Huh or Israeli groups like Combatants for Peace. Their deep integration with the German political sphere tells more about the state of affairs in Germany than about the group. This is the political class' interpretation of the Staatsräson. I don't see any reason to assume "highest standards of political correctness" for them.

xg15 1y ago

I don't think the list is that tiny. Countries cannot vote for themselves, so whatever a broadcaster does in its own country isn't relevant to the votes. (And obviously every country hypes their own candidate as much as possible to their own audience. So does Israel. That's not a problem) I'd also see it as mostly OK if some country wanted to run a standard promo/advertising campaign for their candidate in other voting countries. A bit desperate, yes, but at least the campaign would be obvious to the public and would essentially just raise interest for the candidate's performance at the contest. Where I think it gets potentially deceptive is if you call up people to vote who are not even planning to watch the contest, do so with a clear political motivation - and then later pretend all the votes were organic. (Just checked the group's mails again. Interestingly, their call last year sounded a lot more urgent and openly political. "set an example", "every vote counts", with remarks that you can vote up to 20 times per device. This time the wording was much softer: "we wish her good luck and invite you to vote for her", with no mention of the 20 votes ability. Make of that what you want. Maybe someone complained.)

CLPadvocate 1y ago
Let's just agree that you're pretty biased. Israel runs no campaigns in Germany, the German-Israeli-Society is a German organisation, with mostly Germans as members, supported by the German Ministry of Foreign Affairs and having members of German Parliament as Directors. So, let's assume, it's run according to the highest standards regarding political correctness in Germany. But as you may remember, German television specifically targeted Germans on vacation in Spain (specifically Mallorca) and also Germans living close to the borders to vote for Germany from abroad on multiple occasions in the last years, which can be considered voter fraud without any grey areas. On the other hand, you didn't join the German-British-Society or the German-Swedish-Society or any other society to check if they behave according to your self-defined standards, so I would say, you need to check your own moral compass.
- xg15 1y ago
  Go through the DIG's press releases throughout the war. Their position almost exactly tracks the official position of the Netanyahu government, wrapped in some pseudo-progressive rhetoric (with one(!) notable exception where they criticized Smotrich for planning to officially annex the West Bank). Their positions are also more extreme than even the official German position, e.g. demanding Egypt to accept forced displacement of Gazans into Sinai and all but rejecting the two-state solution. They agitate against any and all groups that dare to show a Palestinian perspective, even established German antifascist groups like Arsch Huh or Israeli groups like Combatants for Peace. Their deep integration with the German political sphere tells more about the state of affairs in Germany than about the group. This is the political class' interpretation of the Staatsräson. I don't see any reason to assume "highest standards of political correctness" for them.