5 ms·

Aren’t those Israeli software companies all supposed to be top notch, ex Mossad, yadda yadda? Doesn’t sound like it. I hope the message dump is juicy.

treebeard901 1y ago
After all the concern over China and TikTok, why is the USG using a foreign chat program at all?
- coolcase 1y ago
  SuperPAC and other corruption
Calwestjobs 1y ago
[flagged]
- basilgohar 1y ago
  This article doesn't mention Mossad, though. Do you have any other sources?
  - MPSFounder 1y ago
    [flagged]
  - Calwestjobs 1y ago
    yes, Shin Bet : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yigal_Amir https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yigal_Amir
viraptor 1y ago
That's not a great generalisation for the whole country. How many ex Mossad people interested in doing actual implementation in tech companies do you think there are? It's like "aren't those US software companies all supposed to be top notch, ex NSA yadda yadda?"
- conradev 1y ago
  They do start a lot of tech companies specifically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_8200#Companies_founded_by_alumni https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_8200#Companies_founded_by... The US only has voluntary military service, so the dynamics are different
- lysp 1y ago
  The CEO/Founder of TeleMessage Guy Levit was the head of the Planning and Development Department of an elite technical unit in the Intelligence Corps of the IDF according to bio.
  - aorloff 1y ago
    I guess we could say that in many ways, he never left
gruez 1y ago
I thought Israel has mandatory military service, so ex-mossad or ex-military signals intelligence doesn't really say much? Presumably they're directing people based on their skill set, so you'd expect most hackers to end up in mossad for their mandatory service.
- kennywinker 1y ago
  > Presumably they're directing people based on their skill set Big presumption. If I were israeli, there’s no way in hell anybody with half a brain would want me near their spy agency. When a gov is committing a genocide, their decisions are based on control and fear, not getting the best out of people. Edit: downvote all you want. Israel is still committing a genocide. No hospitals left standing. Killing aid workers, journalists, and doctors. A million people on the brink of starvation. Literally salting the earth to prevent crops from being grown. That is war crimes, ghettoization, and genocide.
oceanplexian 1y ago
One problem that smart people tend to make is in thinking that being really smart in one area is generalizable to all others. Just because they're good at AppSec doesn't mean they're good at networking or operating a webserver.
- ripley12 1y ago
  I agree with this. It's surprising how often I encounter people with that belief, because I was disabused of it very early on in my career; this industry is chockablock with people who are brilliant in 1 area and deficient in others.
  - coolcase 1y ago
    That's why you need teams. Red team for example! Security team. App developers. Code reviews. You need all the process too. Security that relies on one genius is fragile.
- karn97 1y ago
  That sounds more like a stupid person than smart lol
  - stefs 1y ago
    you can be smart in one area and stupid in others. the "not knowing you're stupid in others" is part of the "stupid in others".
- czl 1y ago
  Aka "halo effect"
msy 1y ago
And SBF of FTX fame was ex-Jane St so obviously was a serious finance professional. This is why using past employers as a shorthand for capability is unwise.
- sillystu04 1y ago
  In fairness, FTX had a profitable bankruptcy [1]. So it's still better to be scammed by Jane Street alumni than to be scammed by the usual alumni of Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan etc [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-15/ftx-bankruptcy-will-pay-customers-over-100-but-they-missed-crypto-rally https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-15/ftx-bankr...
  - coolcase 1y ago
    How is that fair? It was luck from the AI investment. Pure luck.
    - arresin 1y ago
      It wasn’t the only smart investment
    - fredoliveira 1y ago
      Regardless of how you feel about SBF and FTX, claiming an early investment into Anthropic is "luck" rather than being ahead of the curve feels off the mark.
      - coolcase 1y ago
        That is dodging the point. The guy ripped people off. By luck they got the fiat value of their investment at some past date back. Yes if a single investment pays off well enough to negate fraud losses on that scale over a short time scale. It's fucking luck.
  - stackskipton 1y ago
    It's not profitable. They are getting their money back from value of the assets in 2022 when they went bankrupt but most of crypto assets have gone up significantly in value so it's 2.5 years of lost profit.
underdeserver 1y ago
"All supposed to be". This is a country of 10 million people, a rather heterogeneous one at that. There are going to be better and worse companies.
H8crilA 1y ago
They are top notch - at working for profit and for the interests of their country.
rsynnott 1y ago
I'm not sure why you'd expect intelligence agency types to be particularly good at engineering, tbh.
- rainworld 1y ago
  Spooks in general like to project a veneer of competence, downright invincibility. Entertainment media, journalists, experts play a big role in this. And by and large it works. It’s especially true for spooks of a certain entity. Also, it’s easy to confuse brazenness, being protected from consequences, and usually downplayed or secret Western complicity with competence.
  - rsynnott 1y ago
    I mean, I'm sure they're competent in some stuff, but being competent in one field doesn't generally mean being magically competent in _all_ fields.
- keeda 1y ago
  I'm not sure about this case, but maybe the assumption here is that these are people from a technical branch of Mossad, such as Unit 8200, which does SIGINT. I've interviewed 3 of them for your typical Big Tech SWE position, and to a candidate, they were very strong engineers. I never got to work with them, however, because they always got better counteroffers...
ExoticPearTree 1y ago
> Aren’t those Israeli software companies all supposed to be top notch, ex Mossad, yadda yadda? Working with a few companies like these, I can tell you that the marketing is top-notch, and very aggressive. The products not so. Most get better with time.
coolcase 1y ago
Yeah the /leakitbaby endpoint was meant for just them, not the world! Doh!
elzbardico 1y ago
It only takes one guy doing one stupid thing to have a security incident. Yeah, processes should be in place, but no process is perfect.

treebeard901 1y ago

After all the concern over China and TikTok, why is the USG using a foreign chat program at all?

coolcase 1y ago
SuperPAC and other corruption

Calwestjobs 1y ago

[flagged]

basilgohar 1y ago
This article doesn't mention Mossad, though. Do you have any other sources?
- MPSFounder 1y ago
  [flagged]
- Calwestjobs 1y ago
  yes, Shin Bet : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yigal_Amir https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yigal_Amir

viraptor 1y ago

That's not a great generalisation for the whole country. How many ex Mossad people interested in doing actual implementation in tech companies do you think there are? It's like "aren't those US software companies all supposed to be top notch, ex NSA yadda yadda?"

conradev 1y ago
They do start a lot of tech companies specifically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_8200#Companies_founded_by_alumni https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_8200#Companies_founded_by... The US only has voluntary military service, so the dynamics are different
lysp 1y ago
The CEO/Founder of TeleMessage Guy Levit was the head of the Planning and Development Department of an elite technical unit in the Intelligence Corps of the IDF according to bio.
- aorloff 1y ago
  I guess we could say that in many ways, he never left

gruez 1y ago

I thought Israel has mandatory military service, so ex-mossad or ex-military signals intelligence doesn't really say much? Presumably they're directing people based on their skill set, so you'd expect most hackers to end up in mossad for their mandatory service.

kennywinker 1y ago
> Presumably they're directing people based on their skill set Big presumption. If I were israeli, there’s no way in hell anybody with half a brain would want me near their spy agency. When a gov is committing a genocide, their decisions are based on control and fear, not getting the best out of people. Edit: downvote all you want. Israel is still committing a genocide. No hospitals left standing. Killing aid workers, journalists, and doctors. A million people on the brink of starvation. Literally salting the earth to prevent crops from being grown. That is war crimes, ghettoization, and genocide.

oceanplexian 1y ago

One problem that smart people tend to make is in thinking that being really smart in one area is generalizable to all others. Just because they're good at AppSec doesn't mean they're good at networking or operating a webserver.

ripley12 1y ago
I agree with this. It's surprising how often I encounter people with that belief, because I was disabused of it very early on in my career; this industry is chockablock with people who are brilliant in 1 area and deficient in others.
- coolcase 1y ago
  That's why you need teams. Red team for example! Security team. App developers. Code reviews. You need all the process too. Security that relies on one genius is fragile.
karn97 1y ago
That sounds more like a stupid person than smart lol
- stefs 1y ago
  you can be smart in one area and stupid in others. the "not knowing you're stupid in others" is part of the "stupid in others".
czl 1y ago
Aka "halo effect"

msy 1y ago

And SBF of FTX fame was ex-Jane St so obviously was a serious finance professional. This is why using past employers as a shorthand for capability is unwise.

sillystu04 1y ago
In fairness, FTX had a profitable bankruptcy [1]. So it's still better to be scammed by Jane Street alumni than to be scammed by the usual alumni of Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan etc [1] https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-15/ftx-bankruptcy-will-pay-customers-over-100-but-they-missed-crypto-rally https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-15/ftx-bankr...
- coolcase 1y ago
  How is that fair? It was luck from the AI investment. Pure luck.
  - arresin 1y ago
    It wasn’t the only smart investment
  - fredoliveira 1y ago
    Regardless of how you feel about SBF and FTX, claiming an early investment into Anthropic is "luck" rather than being ahead of the curve feels off the mark.
    - coolcase 1y ago
      That is dodging the point. The guy ripped people off. By luck they got the fiat value of their investment at some past date back. Yes if a single investment pays off well enough to negate fraud losses on that scale over a short time scale. It's fucking luck.
- stackskipton 1y ago
  It's not profitable. They are getting their money back from value of the assets in 2022 when they went bankrupt but most of crypto assets have gone up significantly in value so it's 2.5 years of lost profit.

underdeserver 1y ago

"All supposed to be". This is a country of 10 million people, a rather heterogeneous one at that. There are going to be better and worse companies.

H8crilA 1y ago

They are top notch - at working for profit and for the interests of their country.

rsynnott 1y ago

I'm not sure why you'd expect intelligence agency types to be particularly good at engineering, tbh.

rainworld 1y ago
Spooks in general like to project a veneer of competence, downright invincibility. Entertainment media, journalists, experts play a big role in this. And by and large it works. It’s especially true for spooks of a certain entity. Also, it’s easy to confuse brazenness, being protected from consequences, and usually downplayed or secret Western complicity with competence.
- rsynnott 1y ago
  I mean, I'm sure they're competent in some stuff, but being competent in one field doesn't generally mean being magically competent in _all_ fields.
keeda 1y ago
I'm not sure about this case, but maybe the assumption here is that these are people from a technical branch of Mossad, such as Unit 8200, which does SIGINT. I've interviewed 3 of them for your typical Big Tech SWE position, and to a candidate, they were very strong engineers. I never got to work with them, however, because they always got better counteroffers...

ExoticPearTree 1y ago

> Aren’t those Israeli software companies all supposed to be top notch, ex Mossad, yadda yadda? Working with a few companies like these, I can tell you that the marketing is top-notch, and very aggressive. The products not so. Most get better with time.

coolcase 1y ago

Yeah the /leakitbaby endpoint was meant for just them, not the world! Doh!

elzbardico 1y ago

It only takes one guy doing one stupid thing to have a security incident. Yeah, processes should be in place, but no process is perfect.