5 ms·

"It it's a sale, it's taxable". Where does the money go? Wait... I already pay 1000 different taxes every day. We should just blindly accept whatever politicia

"It it's a sale, it's taxable". Where does the money go? Wait... I already pay 1000 different taxes every day. We should just blindly accept whatever politicians tell us to do.

rosser 14y ago
In what world is selling something not going to incur a tax liability?
- deleted 14y ago
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- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- eli 14y ago
  Well, to be fair, that's typically how the online world works in practice in America.
  - einhverfr 14y ago
    Really? They don't pay income tax?
    - mcherm 14y ago
      Sales tax may not apply to online sales in the US (that is changing, and depends on the state involved and whether the company has any presence in the state). Income taxes are never incurred because of sales, only because of income. To oversimplify: no net income -- no income tax.
      - eli 14y ago
        That's not quite true. I believe in every state you are supposed to declare goods you buy online and didn't pay sales tax for in your end of year taxes. I don't think anyone really does this and it hasn't been enforced. The current fight isn't over whether online sales should pay sales tax, but over who should be in charge of collecting that tax: the seller or the buyer.
        einhverfr 14y ago
        It's more complicated than that. Absent SSTP, if I live in a town with a special sales tax, and I buy furniture from the next town over and have it shipped to my house, I get to pay a lower tax rate. With SSTP, they furniture store has to track my address and charge me the higher rate. I don't think use tax has ever been a factor in intrastate sales tax rate variations so this does change what sort of taxes are required.
    - eli 14y ago
      If I sell something on eBay do I pay income tax on it? No, though I suppose I would if I were selling a whole lot of stuff. Similarly, I don't pay sales tax on things I buy on eBay even though I'm supposed to.
      - rprasad 14y ago
        1) eBay reports aggregate sales >$600 to the I.R.S. 2) Most items sold on eBay are sold for less than they were purchased (i.e., anything used), so the likelihood of recognizing gain on any sale is low. No gain recognition = no taxes incurred. 3) Sale of items above (your) purchase price do incur taxable income. If you do not report such income, your tax year never closes. That means there is no deadline as to when the IRS can go after you for penalties and back interest. 4) Sales tax is collected by the seller on behalf of the buyer. You mean "use taxes", which are paid by the buyer himself.
- propercoil 14y ago
  In the world before 1913 when the unconstitutional tax mandate became "law". People are blind
  - _delirium 14y ago
    A Constitutional amendment specifically authorizes income taxes, so it's pretty impossible for them to be unconstitutional. Or are are you referencing one of the theories [1] that the 16th amendment was never ratified? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester_Sixteenth_Amendment_arguments http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester_Sixteenth_Amendme...
    - propercoil 14y ago
      _delirium read the amendment. either way it states clearly that no tax from income should be collected
      - _delirium 14y ago
        The amendment reads in full, as follows: The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration. It quite clearly states exactly the opposite of what you claim.
  - rprasad 14y ago
    A Constitutional Amendment cannot, by definition, be unconstitutional. Please take your FUD back to reddit or whatever bridge you crawled out from under.
    - propercoil 14y ago
      You see there wasn't suppose to be any "Constitutional Amendment" that is exactly the point you moron. Pick up a history book and stop watching fox news
eli 14y ago
"But I pay other taxes" does not seem like a great excuse for not paying sales tax...
- eurleif 14y ago
  This is about income tax, not sales tax. It being a sale is important because if it weren't one, it would be a gift, and gifts aren't subject to income tax.
  - _delirium 14y ago
    Fwiw, the test for gifts under the tax code is payments motivated by "detached and disinterested generosity". So if you get something in return, it's hard for it to count as a gift. It doesn't have to even be a sale per se; for example, tipping at a restaurant is technically a voluntary payment for which you receive nothing in return, but it's not considered sufficiently detached/disinterested to count as a gift.
    - rprasad 14y ago
      Tips are explicitly taxed as income to the recipient. They are not regarded as gifts by any taxing authority in the U.S.
      - _delirium 14y ago
        That's what I was arguing, that you can't classify something as a gift just because technically there is no exchange of consideration. Even though tips formally have no consideration, they still fail the detached/disinterested test, and count as income.
  - eli 14y ago
    Increasingly offtopic now, but gifts are most certainly subject to taxation. You just get an exemption for the first $10k or so.
    - 14y ago
vegardx 14y ago
Without sales tax your income tax would "look insane", and you'd complain just as much. It's just another way to bring in taxes in a way that evenly distributes it among people.

"It it's a sale, it's taxable". Where does the money go? Wait... I already pay 1000 different taxes every day. We should just blindly accept whatever politicians tell us to do.

rosser 14y ago

In what world is selling something not going to incur a tax liability?

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
eli 14y ago
Well, to be fair, that's typically how the online world works in practice in America.
- einhverfr 14y ago
  Really? They don't pay income tax?
  - mcherm 14y ago
    Sales tax may not apply to online sales in the US (that is changing, and depends on the state involved and whether the company has any presence in the state). Income taxes are never incurred because of sales, only because of income. To oversimplify: no net income -- no income tax.
    - eli 14y ago
      That's not quite true. I believe in every state you are supposed to declare goods you buy online and didn't pay sales tax for in your end of year taxes. I don't think anyone really does this and it hasn't been enforced. The current fight isn't over whether online sales should pay sales tax, but over who should be in charge of collecting that tax: the seller or the buyer.
      - einhverfr 14y ago
        It's more complicated than that. Absent SSTP, if I live in a town with a special sales tax, and I buy furniture from the next town over and have it shipped to my house, I get to pay a lower tax rate. With SSTP, they furniture store has to track my address and charge me the higher rate. I don't think use tax has ever been a factor in intrastate sales tax rate variations so this does change what sort of taxes are required.
  - eli 14y ago
    If I sell something on eBay do I pay income tax on it? No, though I suppose I would if I were selling a whole lot of stuff. Similarly, I don't pay sales tax on things I buy on eBay even though I'm supposed to.
    - rprasad 14y ago
      1) eBay reports aggregate sales >$600 to the I.R.S. 2) Most items sold on eBay are sold for less than they were purchased (i.e., anything used), so the likelihood of recognizing gain on any sale is low. No gain recognition = no taxes incurred. 3) Sale of items above (your) purchase price do incur taxable income. If you do not report such income, your tax year never closes. That means there is no deadline as to when the IRS can go after you for penalties and back interest. 4) Sales tax is collected by the seller on behalf of the buyer. You mean "use taxes", which are paid by the buyer himself.
propercoil 14y ago
In the world before 1913 when the unconstitutional tax mandate became "law". People are blind
- _delirium 14y ago
  A Constitutional amendment specifically authorizes income taxes, so it's pretty impossible for them to be unconstitutional. Or are are you referencing one of the theories [1] that the 16th amendment was never ratified? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester_Sixteenth_Amendment_arguments http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_protester_Sixteenth_Amendme...
  - propercoil 14y ago
    _delirium read the amendment. either way it states clearly that no tax from income should be collected
    - _delirium 14y ago
      The amendment reads in full, as follows: The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration. It quite clearly states exactly the opposite of what you claim.
- rprasad 14y ago
  A Constitutional Amendment cannot, by definition, be unconstitutional. Please take your FUD back to reddit or whatever bridge you crawled out from under.
  - propercoil 14y ago
    You see there wasn't suppose to be any "Constitutional Amendment" that is exactly the point you moron. Pick up a history book and stop watching fox news

eli 14y ago

"But I pay other taxes" does not seem like a great excuse for not paying sales tax...

eurleif 14y ago
This is about income tax, not sales tax. It being a sale is important because if it weren't one, it would be a gift, and gifts aren't subject to income tax.
- _delirium 14y ago
  Fwiw, the test for gifts under the tax code is payments motivated by "detached and disinterested generosity". So if you get something in return, it's hard for it to count as a gift. It doesn't have to even be a sale per se; for example, tipping at a restaurant is technically a voluntary payment for which you receive nothing in return, but it's not considered sufficiently detached/disinterested to count as a gift.
  - rprasad 14y ago
    Tips are explicitly taxed as income to the recipient. They are not regarded as gifts by any taxing authority in the U.S.
    - _delirium 14y ago
      That's what I was arguing, that you can't classify something as a gift just because technically there is no exchange of consideration. Even though tips formally have no consideration, they still fail the detached/disinterested test, and count as income.
- eli 14y ago
  Increasingly offtopic now, but gifts are most certainly subject to taxation. You just get an exemption for the first $10k or so.
  - 14y ago

vegardx 14y ago

Without sales tax your income tax would "look insane", and you'd complain just as much. It's just another way to bring in taxes in a way that evenly distributes it among people.