4 ms·

All this usually works out of the box now, especially if you pick your hardware accordingly.

by jraph 1y ago

alex_smart 1y ago
That was certainly not the case ~2 years ago, the last time I installed linux on a laptop. It also doesn't appear to be the case even now. I searched for laptops available in my country that fit my budget and for each laptop searched "<laptop name> linux reddit" on google and filtered for results <1 year old. Each laptop's reports included some or other bug. https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linux_experience_with_hp_envy_x360_2024/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linu... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/lenovo_ideapad_slim_5_gen_9_amd_8845hs_16_inch/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/leno... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_omnibook_ultra_14_ryzen_ai_9_365_a_short_review/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_o... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audio_not_working_lenovo_yoga_7_pro_intel_ultra_7/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audi... The laptop with the best reported linux support seemed to be Thinkpad P14s but even there users reported tweaking some config to get fans to run silently and to make the speakers sound acceptable. https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_p14s_first_impressions_and_linux_configs/ https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_...
- jraph 1y ago
  You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this. And yeah, it's best to wait a bit for new models, as support is sorted out, if the manufacturer doesn't support Linux itself. Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled. That makes the comparison with a laptop with Windows preinstalled fair.
  - alex_smart 1y ago
    > You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this I wasn't cherry-picking things. I literally searched for laptops available in my budget in my country and looked up what was the linux support like for those laptops as reported by people on reddit. > Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled I suppose you are talking about System76, Tuxedo etc. These manufacturers don't ship to my country. Even if I am able to get it shipped, how am I supposed to get warranty?
    - jraph 1y ago
      You weren't cherry picking but the search query you used would lead to issue reports. HP, Dell and Lenovo also sell Linux laptops on which Linux runs well. I sympathize with the more limited availability and budget restrictions, but comparisons must be fair: compare a preinstalled Windows and a preinstalled linux, or at least a linux installed on hardware whose manufacturer bothered to work on Linux support. When the manufacturer did their homework, Linux doesn't have the issues listed earlier. I've seen several laptops of these three brands work flawlessly on Linux and it's been like this for a decade. I certainly choose my laptops with Linux on mind and I know just picking random models would probably lead me to little issues here and there, and I don't want to deal with this. Although I have installed Linux on random laptops for other people and fortunately haven't run into issues.
      - alex_smart 1y ago
        As a buyer, how am I supposed to know which manufacturer did their homework and on which laptops? > it's been like this for a decade Again, depends on the definition of "flawlessly". Afaik, support for hardware accelerated videoplayback on browsers was broken across the board only three years ago.
        jraph 1y ago
        > As a buyer, how am I supposed to know which manufacturer did their homework and on which laptops? You first option is to buy a laptop with linux preinstalled from one of the many manufacturers that provides this. This requires no particular knowledge or time. Admittedly, this may lead you to more expensive options, entry grade laptops won't be an option. Your second best bet is to read tech reviews. Admittedly this requires time and knowledge, but often enough people turn to their tech literate acquaintance for advice when they want to buy hardware. > Afaik, support for hardware accelerated videoplayback on browsers was broken across the board only three years ago. Yes indeed, that's something we didn't have. I agree it sucks. Now, all the OSes have their flaws that others don't have, and it's not like the videos didn't play, in practice it was an issue if you wanted to watch 4K videos for hours on battery. Playing regular videos worked, and you can always lower the quality if your situation doesn't allow the higher qualities. Often enough, you could also get the video and play it outside the browser. I know, not ideal, but also way less annoying that the laptop not suspending when you close the lid because of a glitch or something like this.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
davrosthedalek 1y ago
On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. I have to onboard a lot of students to work on our research. The software is all linux (of course), and mostly distribution-agnostic. Can't be too old, that's it. If a student comes with a random laptop, I install WSL on it, mostly ubuntu. apt install <curated list of packets>. Done. Linux laptops are OK too, I think, but so far only had one student with that. Mac OS used to be easy, but gets harder with every release, and every new OS version breaks something (mainly, CERN root) and people have to wait until it's fixed.
- jraph 1y ago
  > On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. Fair enough. I think the best way to run Linux if you want to be sure you won't have tweak to stuff is to buy hardware with linux preinstalled. That your choice is more limited is another matter than "linux can't suspend". Comparing a preinstalled Windows with a linux installed on random laptop whose manufacturer can't be bothered to support is a bit unfair. Linux on a laptop where the manufacturer did their work runs well.
  - davrosthedalek 1y ago
    Yes, machines with Linux preinstalled normally work quite well. But it's still a downside of choosing Linux that the choice of laptops is so much smaller. Similar to the downside of Mac OS that you are locked in to pricey-but-well-built laptops, or the downside of Windows that "it runs Windows" doesn't mean the hardware is not bottom-of-the-barrel crap with a vendor who doesn't care about Linux compatibility. WSL allows to run a sane development environment even then :)
    - jraph 1y ago
      100% agree

All this usually works out of the box now, especially if you pick your hardware accordingly.

by jraph 1y ago

All this usually works out of the box now, especially if you pick your hardware accordingly.

That was certainly not the case ~2 years ago, the last time I installed linux on a laptop. It also doesn't appear to be the case even now. I searched for laptops available in my country that fit my budget and for each laptop searched "<laptop name> linux reddit" on google and filtered for results <1 year old. Each laptop's reports included some or other bug. https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linux_experience_with_hp_envy_x360_2024/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1hfqptw/linu... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/lenovo_ideapad_slim_5_gen_9_amd_8845hs_16_inch/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1esntt3/leno... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_omnibook_ultra_14_ryzen_ai_9_365_a_short_review/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1j3983j/hp_o... https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audio_not_working_lenovo_yoga_7_pro_intel_ultra_7/ https://www.reddit.com/r/linuxhardware/comments/1k1nsm8/audi... The laptop with the best reported linux support seemed to be Thinkpad P14s but even there users reported tweaking some config to get fans to run silently and to make the speakers sound acceptable. https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_p14s_first_impressions_and_linux_configs/ https://www.reddit.com/r/thinkpad/comments/1c81rw4/thinkpad_...

jraph 1y ago
You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this. And yeah, it's best to wait a bit for new models, as support is sorted out, if the manufacturer doesn't support Linux itself. Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled. That makes the comparison with a laptop with Windows preinstalled fair.
- alex_smart 1y ago
  > You are going to find issues for any computer for any OS by looking things up like this I wasn't cherry-picking things. I literally searched for laptops available in my budget in my country and looked up what was the linux support like for those laptops as reported by people on reddit. > Or pick a manufacturer that sells laptops with Linux preinstalled I suppose you are talking about System76, Tuxedo etc. These manufacturers don't ship to my country. Even if I am able to get it shipped, how am I supposed to get warranty?
  - jraph 1y ago
    You weren't cherry picking but the search query you used would lead to issue reports. HP, Dell and Lenovo also sell Linux laptops on which Linux runs well. I sympathize with the more limited availability and budget restrictions, but comparisons must be fair: compare a preinstalled Windows and a preinstalled linux, or at least a linux installed on hardware whose manufacturer bothered to work on Linux support. When the manufacturer did their homework, Linux doesn't have the issues listed earlier. I've seen several laptops of these three brands work flawlessly on Linux and it's been like this for a decade. I certainly choose my laptops with Linux on mind and I know just picking random models would probably lead me to little issues here and there, and I don't want to deal with this. Although I have installed Linux on random laptops for other people and fortunately haven't run into issues.
    - alex_smart 1y ago
      As a buyer, how am I supposed to know which manufacturer did their homework and on which laptops? > it's been like this for a decade Again, depends on the definition of "flawlessly". Afaik, support for hardware accelerated videoplayback on browsers was broken across the board only three years ago.
      - jraph 1y ago
        > As a buyer, how am I supposed to know which manufacturer did their homework and on which laptops? You first option is to buy a laptop with linux preinstalled from one of the many manufacturers that provides this. This requires no particular knowledge or time. Admittedly, this may lead you to more expensive options, entry grade laptops won't be an option. Your second best bet is to read tech reviews. Admittedly this requires time and knowledge, but often enough people turn to their tech literate acquaintance for advice when they want to buy hardware. > Afaik, support for hardware accelerated videoplayback on browsers was broken across the board only three years ago. Yes indeed, that's something we didn't have. I agree it sucks. Now, all the OSes have their flaws that others don't have, and it's not like the videos didn't play, in practice it was an issue if you wanted to watch 4K videos for hours on battery. Playing regular videos worked, and you can always lower the quality if your situation doesn't allow the higher qualities. Often enough, you could also get the video and play it outside the browser. I know, not ideal, but also way less annoying that the laptop not suspending when you close the lid because of a glitch or something like this.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]

davrosthedalek 1y ago

On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. I have to onboard a lot of students to work on our research. The software is all linux (of course), and mostly distribution-agnostic. Can't be too old, that's it. If a student comes with a random laptop, I install WSL on it, mostly ubuntu. apt install <curated list of packets>. Done. Linux laptops are OK too, I think, but so far only had one student with that. Mac OS used to be easy, but gets harder with every release, and every new OS version breaks something (mainly, CERN root) and people have to wait until it's fixed.

jraph 1y ago
> On Windows, I don't have to pick my hardware accordingly. Fair enough. I think the best way to run Linux if you want to be sure you won't have tweak to stuff is to buy hardware with linux preinstalled. That your choice is more limited is another matter than "linux can't suspend". Comparing a preinstalled Windows with a linux installed on random laptop whose manufacturer can't be bothered to support is a bit unfair. Linux on a laptop where the manufacturer did their work runs well.
- davrosthedalek 1y ago
  Yes, machines with Linux preinstalled normally work quite well. But it's still a downside of choosing Linux that the choice of laptops is so much smaller. Similar to the downside of Mac OS that you are locked in to pricey-but-well-built laptops, or the downside of Windows that "it runs Windows" doesn't mean the hardware is not bottom-of-the-barrel crap with a vendor who doesn't care about Linux compatibility. WSL allows to run a sane development environment even then :)
  - jraph 1y ago
    100% agree