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Whatever happens, they need to decriminalise the license fee. "Almost a third of women’s convictions are for not paying the TV licence fee, figures have reveal

Whatever happens, they need to decriminalise the license fee. "Almost a third of women’s convictions are for not paying the TV licence fee, figures have revealed. Women are ten times more likely to be convicted for not paying the £157.50 annual fee than men – with growing numbers of women then being slapped with criminal records, Ministry of Justice data shows." https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/tv-licence-fee-women-convictions-b1763192.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/tv-licence-f...

gsky 1y ago
BBC would do anything to keep it going sadly
harvey9 1y ago
Some remarkable doublethink from the BBC in that article: "The BBC said licence fee avoidance did not bring with it a criminal record. A spokesperson said: “Details of the offence are not held on the Police National Computer – so while there is a criminal conviction there is no criminal record.”" So yeah, people, mainly women, go to prison but I guess it's not a big deal on paper.
- permo-w 1y ago
  no one is going to prison for not paying the license fee. the article brings up prison, but only as a way to sneakily associate it with non-license fee payment in a way that clearly worked on you
  - harvey9 1y ago
    And yet many people (mainly women) go to prison for, in essence, not paying the licence fee. The fact that they technically go to prison for not complying with a court order is merely splitting hairs. I cancelled my license in the wake of the Saville scandal when it was finally admitted what was common knowledge inside the BBC: that they had been covering up a sex offender on their payroll for years. Obviously 'lessons were learned' so when Huw Edwards came along they repeated all the same mistakes.
    - permo-w 1y ago
      is it splitting hairs though? they're going to prison for refusing to engage with the justice system, which is a very normal thing to go to prison for the world over. what the original offence was isn't really relevant
      - JadeNB 1y ago
        > is it splitting hairs though? they're going to prison for refusing to engage with the justice system, which is a very normal thing to go to prison for the world over. what the original offence was isn't really relevant It is relevant, though. If someone who wouldn't otherwise have been dragged into the receiving end of the justice system gets dragged into it, and then has to comply with all its bureaucracy, it matters whether or not that person should have been dragged into it. ("Should" in both a legal sense and a sense of morality or equity.)
        permo-w 1y ago
        my perspective is that we shouldn't be shaping our laws based on whether the least competent 0.001% of society can deal with the administrative implications. if you're so incompetent that you can't handle any of the many many stages between paying your license fee and going to prison, then you've got bigger issues and perhaps you should be in care or still in school on the other hand if they're deliberately not engaging with those stages, then it's hard to really feel much sympathy
        harvey9 1y ago
        For the most part it's just because they're poor and can't budget either a one off or monthly payment for the fee.
        permo-w 1y ago
        if it goes all the way to going the stage of going to prison, then there are clearly bigger issues than this
permo-w 1y ago
this modern style of criticism is so tiring. if you philosophically disagree with something, don't try to abuse the defence of an oppressed group as a rhetorical technique to make it harder for people to argue with you, just say you disagree with it and why even if you genuinely believe this is why it should be decriminalised, if women are being disproportionally affected, then clearly either there's some kind of bias in the process, which should simply be fixed instead of disbanding the whole process, or women are simply less skilled at dealing with situations like this and need more help. either way it's not an issue with the concept of the license fee I actually don't disagree that the license fee in its current format is a problem, ideally it should just be impossible to access it without having paid, but I don't think it's feasible with the way freeview works
- jpsouth 1y ago
  Anecdotal, but out of my family I’m the only man who doesn’t pay the licence fee, and the only person who hasn’t had a visit. They’ve visited my mother, sister and one auntie that don’t pay - they all live alone and are the sole name on the bill. I’ve heard from friends similar experiences too, single men and households with men on the electoral register don’t get visits, or very rarely if they do. I had the pleasure of answering the door at my mothers to one of these people and believe there’s an issue with the way they choose who to investigate. It’s predatory.
  - permo-w 1y ago
    perhaps there needs to be an inquiry into the issue
    - jpsouth 1y ago
      I doubt Capita would have any fallout from an inquiry, it would be another headline for a day or two then get forgotten by the media. I’m all for it though, they should be held accountable, my first statement is purely cynicism from me.
      - 1y ago

gsky 1y ago

BBC would do anything to keep it going sadly

harvey9 1y ago

Some remarkable doublethink from the BBC in that article: "The BBC said licence fee avoidance did not bring with it a criminal record. A spokesperson said: “Details of the offence are not held on the Police National Computer – so while there is a criminal conviction there is no criminal record.”" So yeah, people, mainly women, go to prison but I guess it's not a big deal on paper.

permo-w 1y ago
no one is going to prison for not paying the license fee. the article brings up prison, but only as a way to sneakily associate it with non-license fee payment in a way that clearly worked on you
- harvey9 1y ago
  And yet many people (mainly women) go to prison for, in essence, not paying the licence fee. The fact that they technically go to prison for not complying with a court order is merely splitting hairs. I cancelled my license in the wake of the Saville scandal when it was finally admitted what was common knowledge inside the BBC: that they had been covering up a sex offender on their payroll for years. Obviously 'lessons were learned' so when Huw Edwards came along they repeated all the same mistakes.
  - permo-w 1y ago
    is it splitting hairs though? they're going to prison for refusing to engage with the justice system, which is a very normal thing to go to prison for the world over. what the original offence was isn't really relevant
    - JadeNB 1y ago
      > is it splitting hairs though? they're going to prison for refusing to engage with the justice system, which is a very normal thing to go to prison for the world over. what the original offence was isn't really relevant It is relevant, though. If someone who wouldn't otherwise have been dragged into the receiving end of the justice system gets dragged into it, and then has to comply with all its bureaucracy, it matters whether or not that person should have been dragged into it. ("Should" in both a legal sense and a sense of morality or equity.)
      - permo-w 1y ago
        my perspective is that we shouldn't be shaping our laws based on whether the least competent 0.001% of society can deal with the administrative implications. if you're so incompetent that you can't handle any of the many many stages between paying your license fee and going to prison, then you've got bigger issues and perhaps you should be in care or still in school on the other hand if they're deliberately not engaging with those stages, then it's hard to really feel much sympathy
        harvey9 1y ago
        For the most part it's just because they're poor and can't budget either a one off or monthly payment for the fee.
        permo-w 1y ago
        if it goes all the way to going the stage of going to prison, then there are clearly bigger issues than this

permo-w 1y ago

this modern style of criticism is so tiring. if you philosophically disagree with something, don't try to abuse the defence of an oppressed group as a rhetorical technique to make it harder for people to argue with you, just say you disagree with it and why even if you genuinely believe this is why it should be decriminalised, if women are being disproportionally affected, then clearly either there's some kind of bias in the process, which should simply be fixed instead of disbanding the whole process, or women are simply less skilled at dealing with situations like this and need more help. either way it's not an issue with the concept of the license fee I actually don't disagree that the license fee in its current format is a problem, ideally it should just be impossible to access it without having paid, but I don't think it's feasible with the way freeview works

jpsouth 1y ago
Anecdotal, but out of my family I’m the only man who doesn’t pay the licence fee, and the only person who hasn’t had a visit. They’ve visited my mother, sister and one auntie that don’t pay - they all live alone and are the sole name on the bill. I’ve heard from friends similar experiences too, single men and households with men on the electoral register don’t get visits, or very rarely if they do. I had the pleasure of answering the door at my mothers to one of these people and believe there’s an issue with the way they choose who to investigate. It’s predatory.
- permo-w 1y ago
  perhaps there needs to be an inquiry into the issue
  - jpsouth 1y ago
    I doubt Capita would have any fallout from an inquiry, it would be another headline for a day or two then get forgotten by the media. I’m all for it though, they should be held accountable, my first statement is purely cynicism from me.
    - 1y ago