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Politicians attempting to improve their chances at elections is about as far from a conspiracy theory as you can get. (Why were the Dems gaslighting the public

Politicians attempting to improve their chances at elections is about as far from a conspiracy theory as you can get. (Why were the Dems gaslighting the public about how "difficult" it was to solve the border problem? For years we've heard ...."We need legislation! We need more money!"). Trump closed the border within weeks so clearly the Dems were lying through their teeth (nobody is shocked, the Dems have been lying about everything). And your "trend" argument is very weak, people were surprised at the demographic trends in the recent election even though it was a minor bump. So it's not really a good explanation for the last 4 years of wide-open borders. We are in the very early stages of major change and disruption. III make my assessment after a year or two, not after a few months into the new presidency.

shadowgovt 1y ago
The conspiracy theory is that the immigration policy is about encouraging demographic shift because it benefits some politicians over others (as opposed to other explanations such as "There's only but so much you can do to discourage immigration before it crosses over into 'cruelty unbecoming a civilized society'"). It really doesn't hold up to scrutiny of either evidence (Latinos supported Trump significantly in the 2024 election) or common sense ("if immigrants cause problems, wouldn't politicians supporting free immigration lose votes, not gain them? So you end up with a state with more representation but then you hand the representation immediately to the other party? Who benefits?"). > Trump closed the border within weeks Then what happened? https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-05-13/the-us-travel-economy-is-headed-for-a-12-billion-slump-this-year https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-05-13/the-us-tr... Here's a counter-hypothesis: Maybe the Dems didn't do that when they were in power because it was a very stupid idea. There are many, many ways to "solve" the border problem that leave the country far worse off than when the problem was just unsolved. What is your trust level in this administration finding them? > We are in the very early stages of major change and disruption On this, we agree. Though I suspect you're thinking more "new, better America" and I'm thinking "Fall of Rome." His last term ended with a barely-managed pandemic; maybe he can top himself in round 2.
- lazyeye 1y ago
  If you scroll down on this page you can see the historical trend for the latino demographic:- https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-presidential-election https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-pr... Note in the 2020 election more than double the number of Latinos voted Democrat over Republican. With the massive levels of illegal immigration under the Biden open border policy, the demographic voting shift would have likely happened in the medium term as the millions of illegals slowly merged into the legal population (from 5 years onwards). And of course, within a year or two the Dems would have been clamouring to have the illegals made into citizens. I think the Dems thought they could get away with it because they had enough of the media on their side (CNN, NYT etc) to carry water for them. But with podcasts, social media etc the media landscape has changed drastically and they weren't able to control the narrative the way they have previously. And this was particularly catastrophic given Kamala Harris was such a poor candidate seemingly pathologically incapable of saying anything beyond rehearsed talking points (and as a consequence largely avoided podcasts). We can come back in year and everything could be amazing but based on what I've seen so far, I'm sure you would come up with some tortured logic as to why up is down, black is white and it's the worst economy ever etc...
  - shadowgovt 1y ago
    If we're still deporting cancer patients mid-treatment, things can't be amazing in a year somewhat by definition. It's not the logic that's being tortured; it's human beings. When did we become a nation so cowardly that we have to deport sick kids to feel safe?
    - lazyeye 1y ago
      Neither of us have the faintest clue what the actual specific details were of this situation you are attempting use as some form of emotional blackmail. The utterly corrupt Biden administration allowed millions of illegals into this country to sway the voter demographics in their favor. This situation is 100% on them, the current administration is simply attempting to clean up their mess.

shadowgovt 1y ago

The conspiracy theory is that the immigration policy is about encouraging demographic shift because it benefits some politicians over others (as opposed to other explanations such as "There's only but so much you can do to discourage immigration before it crosses over into 'cruelty unbecoming a civilized society'"). It really doesn't hold up to scrutiny of either evidence (Latinos supported Trump significantly in the 2024 election) or common sense ("if immigrants cause problems, wouldn't politicians supporting free immigration lose votes, not gain them? So you end up with a state with more representation but then you hand the representation immediately to the other party? Who benefits?"). > Trump closed the border within weeks Then what happened? https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-05-13/the-us-travel-economy-is-headed-for-a-12-billion-slump-this-year https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-05-13/the-us-tr... Here's a counter-hypothesis: Maybe the Dems didn't do that when they were in power because it was a very stupid idea. There are many, many ways to "solve" the border problem that leave the country far worse off than when the problem was just unsolved. What is your trust level in this administration finding them? > We are in the very early stages of major change and disruption On this, we agree. Though I suspect you're thinking more "new, better America" and I'm thinking "Fall of Rome." His last term ended with a barely-managed pandemic; maybe he can top himself in round 2.

lazyeye 1y ago
If you scroll down on this page you can see the historical trend for the latino demographic:- https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-presidential-election https://www.as-coa.org/articles/how-latinos-voted-2024-us-pr... Note in the 2020 election more than double the number of Latinos voted Democrat over Republican. With the massive levels of illegal immigration under the Biden open border policy, the demographic voting shift would have likely happened in the medium term as the millions of illegals slowly merged into the legal population (from 5 years onwards). And of course, within a year or two the Dems would have been clamouring to have the illegals made into citizens. I think the Dems thought they could get away with it because they had enough of the media on their side (CNN, NYT etc) to carry water for them. But with podcasts, social media etc the media landscape has changed drastically and they weren't able to control the narrative the way they have previously. And this was particularly catastrophic given Kamala Harris was such a poor candidate seemingly pathologically incapable of saying anything beyond rehearsed talking points (and as a consequence largely avoided podcasts). We can come back in year and everything could be amazing but based on what I've seen so far, I'm sure you would come up with some tortured logic as to why up is down, black is white and it's the worst economy ever etc...
- shadowgovt 1y ago
  If we're still deporting cancer patients mid-treatment, things can't be amazing in a year somewhat by definition. It's not the logic that's being tortured; it's human beings. When did we become a nation so cowardly that we have to deport sick kids to feel safe?
  - lazyeye 1y ago
    Neither of us have the faintest clue what the actual specific details were of this situation you are attempting use as some form of emotional blackmail. The utterly corrupt Biden administration allowed millions of illegals into this country to sway the voter demographics in their favor. This situation is 100% on them, the current administration is simply attempting to clean up their mess.