3 ms·

Would have been great if they used an European alternative ( like Codeberg ).

by mentalgear 1y ago

selectnull 1y ago
Mozilla is US organization, why would they care to?
- neilv 1y ago
  As for European specifically, maybe the commenter was talking about data protection laws. If not, maybe (in many European countries at the moment) less national or business background of ruthlessness. I was thinking something different: I wonder whether Mozilla considered GitLab or Codeberg, which are the other two I know that are popular with open source projects that don't trust GitHub since it sold out to Microsoft. (FWIW, Microsoft has been relatively gentle or subtle with GitHub, for whatever reason. Though presumably MS will backstab eventually. And you can debate whether that's already started, such as with pushing "AI" that launders open source software copyrights, and offering to indemnify users for violations. But I'd guess that a project would be pragmatically fine at least near term going with GitHub, though they're not setting a great example.)
  - selectnull 1y ago
    Given the Mozilla direction lately, the last thing they want is good data protection laws.
    - fsflover 1y ago
      This is a huge exaggeration, borderline dishonest attack.
      - selectnull 1y ago
        Time will tell. I would love to be wrong.
        fsflover 1y ago
        You didn't even provide any actual context making it impossible to argue with you. HN should have better conversations than shallow dismissals (according to the guidelines).
        neilv 1y ago
        I sorta agree with this comment, but would rephrase that to "unclear what direction is being referred to". (Arguing may come next, but first comes communicating.)
        selectnull 1y ago
        You are completely correct, my comment was shallow and that was my fault. Here is my opinion on Mozilla and their direction: in the previous decade (or a little bit more) or so their primary money bringer was Google, paying for the default search engine placement in Firefox. Annually, that brought about half a billion US (I don't have the exact amounts, but let's assume in that decade they should have earned a few billions). At the same time, Firefox continuously lost market share and with that, the power to steer the web in the direction of privacy (1) and open standards (2). (1) instead, they've acquired Anonym, an ad business which touts itself to be interested in user's privacy. color me sceptic on that one. (2) it's all Chrome and iOS. Firefox is a lagard. So, what has Mozilla done with the billions? Have they invested it in Firefox? MDN perhaps? Are they the web champions they have been in 2010s? You can still argue that these points are shallow. My original comment was motivated by my disappointment in Mozilla's lost opportunity to be a fighter for an open web. Instead they have sold their soul to the highest (and only) bidder.
        fsflover 1y ago
        > color me sceptic on that one. This is fair but not sufficient to declare "the last thing they want is good data protection laws". > it's all Chrome and iOS. > So, what has Mozilla done with the billions? This is also fair but has nothing to do with the data protection laws. > Instead they have sold their soul to the highest (and only) bidder. It seems they can't continue doing this, given the ongoing legal actions against Google. So let's see.
pparanoidd 1y ago
lol codeberg is down right now, bad timing
- berkes 1y ago
  I've used Codeberg for some projects and while their work and services are impressive and their progress steady and good, it's really not a proper alternative to Github for many use-cases. "It depends", as always, but codeberg lacks features (that your use-case may not need, or may require), uptime/performance (that may be crucial or inconsequential to your use-case), familiarity (that may deter devs), integration (that may be time-consuming to build yourself or be unnessecary for your case) etc etc.

Would have been great if they used an European alternative ( like Codeberg ).

selectnull 1y ago

Mozilla is US organization, why would they care to?

neilv 1y ago
As for European specifically, maybe the commenter was talking about data protection laws. If not, maybe (in many European countries at the moment) less national or business background of ruthlessness. I was thinking something different: I wonder whether Mozilla considered GitLab or Codeberg, which are the other two I know that are popular with open source projects that don't trust GitHub since it sold out to Microsoft. (FWIW, Microsoft has been relatively gentle or subtle with GitHub, for whatever reason. Though presumably MS will backstab eventually. And you can debate whether that's already started, such as with pushing "AI" that launders open source software copyrights, and offering to indemnify users for violations. But I'd guess that a project would be pragmatically fine at least near term going with GitHub, though they're not setting a great example.)
- selectnull 1y ago
  Given the Mozilla direction lately, the last thing they want is good data protection laws.
  - fsflover 1y ago
    This is a huge exaggeration, borderline dishonest attack.
    - selectnull 1y ago
      Time will tell. I would love to be wrong.
      - fsflover 1y ago
        You didn't even provide any actual context making it impossible to argue with you. HN should have better conversations than shallow dismissals (according to the guidelines).
        neilv 1y ago
        I sorta agree with this comment, but would rephrase that to "unclear what direction is being referred to". (Arguing may come next, but first comes communicating.)
        selectnull 1y ago
        You are completely correct, my comment was shallow and that was my fault. Here is my opinion on Mozilla and their direction: in the previous decade (or a little bit more) or so their primary money bringer was Google, paying for the default search engine placement in Firefox. Annually, that brought about half a billion US (I don't have the exact amounts, but let's assume in that decade they should have earned a few billions). At the same time, Firefox continuously lost market share and with that, the power to steer the web in the direction of privacy (1) and open standards (2). (1) instead, they've acquired Anonym, an ad business which touts itself to be interested in user's privacy. color me sceptic on that one. (2) it's all Chrome and iOS. Firefox is a lagard. So, what has Mozilla done with the billions? Have they invested it in Firefox? MDN perhaps? Are they the web champions they have been in 2010s? You can still argue that these points are shallow. My original comment was motivated by my disappointment in Mozilla's lost opportunity to be a fighter for an open web. Instead they have sold their soul to the highest (and only) bidder.
        fsflover 1y ago
        > color me sceptic on that one. This is fair but not sufficient to declare "the last thing they want is good data protection laws". > it's all Chrome and iOS. > So, what has Mozilla done with the billions? This is also fair but has nothing to do with the data protection laws. > Instead they have sold their soul to the highest (and only) bidder. It seems they can't continue doing this, given the ongoing legal actions against Google. So let's see.

pparanoidd 1y ago

lol codeberg is down right now, bad timing

berkes 1y ago
I've used Codeberg for some projects and while their work and services are impressive and their progress steady and good, it's really not a proper alternative to Github for many use-cases. "It depends", as always, but codeberg lacks features (that your use-case may not need, or may require), uptime/performance (that may be crucial or inconsequential to your use-case), familiarity (that may deter devs), integration (that may be time-consuming to build yourself or be unnessecary for your case) etc etc.