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If one altruistically decides to give to society then I'm unsure what outcomes one should expect from society? What's the game-theory here? If one wants somethi

If one altruistically decides to give to society then I'm unsure what outcomes one should expect from society? What's the game-theory here? If one wants something back then who is responsible to get something back? My canonical example is Linus: if the world was fair he should be worth some pretty big numbers. It is harder to pick what is fair in return for someone's scientific innovation. I would guess Linus has generated as much worth as Microsoft, so in an ideal world he should be worth a Bill Gates. Linus has mostly chosen other non-financial goals to chase (unlike Bill). Linus $50 million, Bill Gates $156 billion. “While I may not get any money from Linux, I get a huge personal satisfaction from having written something that people really enjoy using.” “The cyberspace earnings I get from Linux come in the format of having a network of people that know me and trust me, and that I can depend on in return.” Some people that complain about the wealthy making money are selfishly obsessed about money themselves. Perhaps even hypocritically denegrating others as too-money-focused when others choose to win the money making game. Unfortunately our world tends to be very focused on financial gains; and often completely ignoring non-financial benefits. What are the non-financial benefits of an iPhone compared to the money paid for it? How much is job-enjoyment or job-status worth; compared against either the money earned or the time spent?

realityking 1y ago
> I would guess Linus has generated as much worth as Microsoft Microsoft makes everything from game consoles to ERP systems while Linus created one part of an operating system and a source control system. Linus certainly captured less of the economic value he created than Microsoft’s founders shareholders but Microsoft has generated much, much more (economic) value.
- robocat 1y ago
  Well, I'll pick a similar counterexample then. Microsoft valued Github at over $7.5 billion in stock at acquisition. git was developed by Linus, subsequently generating economic value for Microsoft. What was git worth economically? Did Microsoft pay Linus for any of the value it received?
  - firesteelrain 1y ago
    Git is foundational. GitHub added value by building collaboration tools, UIs, CI/CD integration, and a social coding layer on top of Git. Git is licensed under the GNU General Public License (GPL v2), which allows anyone to use, modify, and distribute it freely under its terms. It’s an infrastructure that others build on.
  - maratc 1y ago
    There is tremendous value in git, however you need to take into consideration the fact that 100% of the people and companies who pay GitHub (and thus, generate value for Microsoft) have the option of just using git without GitHub, for $0. This causes me to think that what these people are actually paying for is GitHub, and not git. Which causes me to think that, when Microsoft valued Github at over $7.5 billion, that value reflected the value of GitHub sans git. Linus is in business of advancing the humanity, without making billions in the process. I can only salute him for that.
- Miraste 1y ago
  I'm not sure about that. Linux runs effectively the entire internet, as well as the majority of personal computing devices (there are more Android phones out there than Windows PCs and iPhones combined), and everything from rockets to toasters. That's a lot of economic value.
raddan 1y ago
> If one altruistically decides to give to society then I'm unsure what outcomes one should expect from society? What's the game-theory here? I’m not sure if you’re asking rhetorically, but answering your question literally speaking: none. If you’re giving altruistically then you should expect nothing back. As you point out, many projects whose goal is more personal satisfaction than money-making do indeed generate tremendous value, and in some cases, lots of money too. It’s hard to quantify the value of open source but I would not be surprised if its value exceeded the value of commercial, closed source software.

realityking 1y ago

> I would guess Linus has generated as much worth as Microsoft Microsoft makes everything from game consoles to ERP systems while Linus created one part of an operating system and a source control system. Linus certainly captured less of the economic value he created than Microsoft’s founders shareholders but Microsoft has generated much, much more (economic) value.

robocat 1y ago
Well, I'll pick a similar counterexample then. Microsoft valued Github at over $7.5 billion in stock at acquisition. git was developed by Linus, subsequently generating economic value for Microsoft. What was git worth economically? Did Microsoft pay Linus for any of the value it received?
- firesteelrain 1y ago
  Git is foundational. GitHub added value by building collaboration tools, UIs, CI/CD integration, and a social coding layer on top of Git. Git is licensed under the GNU General Public License (GPL v2), which allows anyone to use, modify, and distribute it freely under its terms. It’s an infrastructure that others build on.
- maratc 1y ago
  There is tremendous value in git, however you need to take into consideration the fact that 100% of the people and companies who pay GitHub (and thus, generate value for Microsoft) have the option of just using git without GitHub, for $0. This causes me to think that what these people are actually paying for is GitHub, and not git. Which causes me to think that, when Microsoft valued Github at over $7.5 billion, that value reflected the value of GitHub sans git. Linus is in business of advancing the humanity, without making billions in the process. I can only salute him for that.
Miraste 1y ago
I'm not sure about that. Linux runs effectively the entire internet, as well as the majority of personal computing devices (there are more Android phones out there than Windows PCs and iPhones combined), and everything from rockets to toasters. That's a lot of economic value.

raddan 1y ago

> If one altruistically decides to give to society then I'm unsure what outcomes one should expect from society? What's the game-theory here? I’m not sure if you’re asking rhetorically, but answering your question literally speaking: none. If you’re giving altruistically then you should expect nothing back. As you point out, many projects whose goal is more personal satisfaction than money-making do indeed generate tremendous value, and in some cases, lots of money too. It’s hard to quantify the value of open source but I would not be surprised if its value exceeded the value of commercial, closed source software.