4 ms·

Interesting ad seeking Lisp developers (not 'mere coders')

22 points by anuraggoel 18y ago

gruseom 18y ago
It certainly is an interesting ad. Horrifically interesting, but interesting nonetheless. It seems to me that this statement could also be about the ad itself: Lispers seem to be a breed of uber-nerds (super nerds) who are extremely clever in some ways but utterly foolish in others.
- gibsonf1 18y ago
  It does seem like you'd have to be foolish to code in Lisp for $11/hour. Maybe that's why they have to keep reposting the ad? Maybe they're looking for 3rd-world coutry lispers?
  - critic 18y ago
    I think Mr. Maas of c.l.l offered to write Lisp for minimum wage. I think he's in Bay area.
  - gruseom 18y ago
    The way the ad is written, I half-expected it to demand that you pay them for the privilege.
  - KirinDave 18y ago
    Coding for $11/hour is foolish, period. Seriously, that's way undervaluing the skill!
- cabalamat 18y ago
  > It certainly is an interesting ad. Horrifically interesting It reminds me of this apartment rental ad from Craigslist -- http://consumerist.com/5130759/worst-apartment-rental-ad-ever http://consumerist.com/5130759/worst-apartment-rental-ad-eve...
  - ptuzla 18y ago
    Your metaphor really tells it all...
anc2020 18y ago
Summary: In taking this job, you will be my bitch.
- ratsbane 18y ago
  This ad is strangely compelling. anc2020 is right, they are a bit blunt and demanding, but there's an honesty and intelligence in their approach that's admirable. A lot of employers expect you to be their bitch but they'll cover it up with fuzzy words. I'm probably not going to respond to this ad; the pay is just too low, but I'd like to have lunch some day with whoever is behind this.
  - Niten 18y ago
    > I'd like to have lunch some day with whoever is behind this. Don't; you'd probably be stuck with the check.
- vaksel 18y ago
  or they are just trying to get a lot of work done for free. Pick a dozen developers, have each work the 10 hours, hard work too, since the people would be working their ass off trying to make a good impression....then tell them "Sorry you didn't live up to our standards". Not likely though, since then they'd offer to pay more than the minimum wage
  - fp 18y ago
    I also thought, that these small "test" assignments might be a trick to get (some part of) the work for free. In ten hours for free plus ten hours at five per cent, times the number of eager programmers, you can get a lot of footwork done. > Not likely though, since then they'd offer to pay more than the minimum wage The minimum wage could be helpful to get applications only from a certain type of programmers: Those who don't mind a low salary and care more about the Lisp experience and learning new things. I myself would probably like to have that kind of people on my team. If anyone here takes the job, please let us know how it goes. ;-)
- jaytee_clone 18y ago
ggruschow 18y ago
I really like this ad. I'm not sure if I think it's good, but at least it's different. Will they actually get what they want? If so, I need to consider changing my business models. The world's a lot different than I thought if you can actually get someone good for those rates. I'm tempted to do their 2 hour test, 10 hours of development, and get started on their work just to see what they're doing, what they're like, and get some of my other questions answered.
- gaius 18y ago
  That's a good point. Is it possible to hire a LISP programmer for those conditions? Where? Not even in India I'd wager, esp. when Tata will hire anyone, for more money/fewer hours, and give them a benefits package too.
  - ggruschow 18y ago
    This is definitely interesting: http://www.getafreelancer.com/users/feedback_218576.html http://www.getafreelancer.com/users/feedback_218576.html Looking through some of those, it seems the target audience is Eastern Europeans, not Indians.
Dilpil 18y ago
"We will pay each developer $1500- $2200 for working 200 hours per month. That is 7.50 US dollars to 11 US dollars per hour." ...will you now.
bonaldi 18y ago
"Hi, we are setting ourselves up to fail, and are looking for people inexperienced in something difficult. Can you help? There's a good chance we won't pay you at all, btw"
- derefr 18y ago
  Indeed. I imagine they get all their work done during the "probationary period," then refuse the person at the last moment and repost the ad. (I think I could build basically any software you wish using well-divided piecework prepared as "tests." Anyone want to take the bet?) Actually, thinking about it, I could probably hide bomb trajectory calculations in public school math curricula as well. It sort of reminds me of steganography, or of the Manhattan project...
anuraggoel 18y ago
Here's some insight into the poster in his/her own words: "Frankly, if you knew me you might not like me because I'm as demanding as the job I have advertised is fascinating. In other words, I'm extremely demanding. I'm looking for an extremely clever developer who is ravenous for designing and developing great software. Finally, I'm looking for talent; experience means virtually nothing to me whatsoever." http://www.getafreelancer.com/pmb/mb366601.html#view http://www.getafreelancer.com/pmb/mb366601.html#view
- gaius 18y ago
  Someone smart enough to do "cutting edge" code, but not smart enough to know they getting screwed? Dude's watched Rain Man one too many times. Incidentally he mentions that he's using mod_lisp so this is probably a website... Anyone got a URL?
  - anc2020 18y ago
    > Incidentally he mentions that he's using mod_lisp A cleverly laid decoy.
time_management 18y ago
Lispers seem to be a breed of uber-nerds (super nerds) who are extremely clever in some ways but utterly foolish in others. Lisp is an excellent language for developing software but generally we find Lispers to be arrogant, annoying, and not worth dealing with. Therefore, if you are a Lisper, unless you are an unusual Lisper, please don't apply for this job. Instead, please go back to commiserate with your fellow Lispers about how hardly any Lisp jobs exist. Ok? "Applicant must not have a chip on his shoulder, because this would draw attention to the plank that is on mine. "
- deleted 18y ago
  [deleted]
ojbyrne 18y ago
This was posted 2 weeks ago (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=427250 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=427250) and deleted.
owkaye 18y ago
He has clearly dealt with 'foreigners' in the programming world before. He knows exactly how to explain his needs and requirements in blunt detail, and this is an absolute requirement if you want to avoid wasting time considering losers who will flood you with job applications even when they know they are not qualified. I think he's hoping that his ad will discourage most of the programmers who would otherwise apply -- thus leaving only a very few applications to review. I've run ads very similar to this in my efforts to hire local Filipino programmers for my outsourcing business. I It just 'makes sense' to me, and to anyone else who has actually been in a similar situation too I presume.
muriithi 18y ago
They have posted this twice on GAF and on both occassions have cancelled the ad after a few days. This ad was cancelled on the 18th. This must be the work of one of those bipolar lisp coders uhhhm sorry programmers(http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=78739 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=78739).

22 points by anuraggoel 18y ago

It certainly is an interesting ad. Horrifically interesting, but interesting nonetheless. It seems to me that this statement could also be about the ad itself: Lispers seem to be a breed of uber-nerds (super nerds) who are extremely clever in some ways but utterly foolish in others.

gibsonf1 18y ago
It does seem like you'd have to be foolish to code in Lisp for $11/hour. Maybe that's why they have to keep reposting the ad? Maybe they're looking for 3rd-world coutry lispers?
- critic 18y ago
  I think Mr. Maas of c.l.l offered to write Lisp for minimum wage. I think he's in Bay area.
- gruseom 18y ago
  The way the ad is written, I half-expected it to demand that you pay them for the privilege.
- KirinDave 18y ago
  Coding for $11/hour is foolish, period. Seriously, that's way undervaluing the skill!
cabalamat 18y ago
> It certainly is an interesting ad. Horrifically interesting It reminds me of this apartment rental ad from Craigslist -- http://consumerist.com/5130759/worst-apartment-rental-ad-ever http://consumerist.com/5130759/worst-apartment-rental-ad-eve...
- ptuzla 18y ago
  Your metaphor really tells it all...

anc2020 18y ago

Summary: In taking this job, you will be my bitch.

ratsbane 18y ago
This ad is strangely compelling. anc2020 is right, they are a bit blunt and demanding, but there's an honesty and intelligence in their approach that's admirable. A lot of employers expect you to be their bitch but they'll cover it up with fuzzy words. I'm probably not going to respond to this ad; the pay is just too low, but I'd like to have lunch some day with whoever is behind this.
- Niten 18y ago
  > I'd like to have lunch some day with whoever is behind this. Don't; you'd probably be stuck with the check.
vaksel 18y ago
or they are just trying to get a lot of work done for free. Pick a dozen developers, have each work the 10 hours, hard work too, since the people would be working their ass off trying to make a good impression....then tell them "Sorry you didn't live up to our standards". Not likely though, since then they'd offer to pay more than the minimum wage
- fp 18y ago
  I also thought, that these small "test" assignments might be a trick to get (some part of) the work for free. In ten hours for free plus ten hours at five per cent, times the number of eager programmers, you can get a lot of footwork done. > Not likely though, since then they'd offer to pay more than the minimum wage The minimum wage could be helpful to get applications only from a certain type of programmers: Those who don't mind a low salary and care more about the Lisp experience and learning new things. I myself would probably like to have that kind of people on my team. If anyone here takes the job, please let us know how it goes. ;-)
jaytee_clone 18y ago

ggruschow 18y ago

I really like this ad. I'm not sure if I think it's good, but at least it's different. Will they actually get what they want? If so, I need to consider changing my business models. The world's a lot different than I thought if you can actually get someone good for those rates. I'm tempted to do their 2 hour test, 10 hours of development, and get started on their work just to see what they're doing, what they're like, and get some of my other questions answered.

gaius 18y ago
That's a good point. Is it possible to hire a LISP programmer for those conditions? Where? Not even in India I'd wager, esp. when Tata will hire anyone, for more money/fewer hours, and give them a benefits package too.
- ggruschow 18y ago
  This is definitely interesting: http://www.getafreelancer.com/users/feedback_218576.html http://www.getafreelancer.com/users/feedback_218576.html Looking through some of those, it seems the target audience is Eastern Europeans, not Indians.

Dilpil 18y ago

"We will pay each developer $1500- $2200 for working 200 hours per month. That is 7.50 US dollars to 11 US dollars per hour." ...will you now.

bonaldi 18y ago

"Hi, we are setting ourselves up to fail, and are looking for people inexperienced in something difficult. Can you help? There's a good chance we won't pay you at all, btw"

derefr 18y ago
Indeed. I imagine they get all their work done during the "probationary period," then refuse the person at the last moment and repost the ad. (I think I could build basically any software you wish using well-divided piecework prepared as "tests." Anyone want to take the bet?) Actually, thinking about it, I could probably hide bomb trajectory calculations in public school math curricula as well. It sort of reminds me of steganography, or of the Manhattan project...

anuraggoel 18y ago

Here's some insight into the poster in his/her own words: "Frankly, if you knew me you might not like me because I'm as demanding as the job I have advertised is fascinating. In other words, I'm extremely demanding. I'm looking for an extremely clever developer who is ravenous for designing and developing great software. Finally, I'm looking for talent; experience means virtually nothing to me whatsoever." http://www.getafreelancer.com/pmb/mb366601.html#view http://www.getafreelancer.com/pmb/mb366601.html#view

gaius 18y ago
Someone smart enough to do "cutting edge" code, but not smart enough to know they getting screwed? Dude's watched Rain Man one too many times. Incidentally he mentions that he's using mod_lisp so this is probably a website... Anyone got a URL?
- anc2020 18y ago
  > Incidentally he mentions that he's using mod_lisp A cleverly laid decoy.

time_management 18y ago

Lispers seem to be a breed of uber-nerds (super nerds) who are extremely clever in some ways but utterly foolish in others. Lisp is an excellent language for developing software but generally we find Lispers to be arrogant, annoying, and not worth dealing with. Therefore, if you are a Lisper, unless you are an unusual Lisper, please don't apply for this job. Instead, please go back to commiserate with your fellow Lispers about how hardly any Lisp jobs exist. Ok? "Applicant must not have a chip on his shoulder, because this would draw attention to the plank that is on mine. "

deleted 18y ago
[deleted]

ojbyrne 18y ago

This was posted 2 weeks ago (http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=427250 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=427250) and deleted.

owkaye 18y ago

He has clearly dealt with 'foreigners' in the programming world before. He knows exactly how to explain his needs and requirements in blunt detail, and this is an absolute requirement if you want to avoid wasting time considering losers who will flood you with job applications even when they know they are not qualified. I think he's hoping that his ad will discourage most of the programmers who would otherwise apply -- thus leaving only a very few applications to review. I've run ads very similar to this in my efforts to hire local Filipino programmers for my outsourcing business. I It just 'makes sense' to me, and to anyone else who has actually been in a similar situation too I presume.

muriithi 18y ago

They have posted this twice on GAF and on both occassions have cancelled the ad after a few days. This ad was cancelled on the 18th. This must be the work of one of those bipolar lisp coders uhhhm sorry programmers(http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=78739 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=78739).