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Where can I follow Odin's progress other than the blog? It doesn't seems to have any social media presence. And what sort of time frame in terms of 1.0? I foun

by ksec 1y ago

Where can I follow Odin's progress other than the blog? It doesn't seems to have any social media presence. And what sort of time frame in terms of 1.0? I found Odin lacks the marketing push from Zig or Rust.

gingerBill 1y ago
So Odin the language in-itself is effectively done. But of course the core library, vendor library, tooling, etc are still very much being improved. The reason for the lack of "social media presence" is because Odin is kind of weird to market for: https://www.gingerbill.org/article/2024/09/08/odin-weird-to-market/ https://www.gingerbill.org/article/2024/09/08/odin-weird-to-... It's not "hypeable" like Zig or Rust mainly because it doesn't have any "killer features" but rather is a very pragmatic language by design. The people Odin attracts are also not the types of people to evangelize Odin either, since they are not there for the hype-train but to actually program. So if you can help us find a way to market Odin itself without lying or exaggerating or overblowing minor features, then that would be very much obliged. It's a lot harder than you think. As for "1.0", we have never worked to a timeframe for anything nor any sort of roadmap. The reason being is that we do not want to give false promises/hope about anything. Roadmaps are purely for advertisement, and the problem is, we don't even work to one so why present one? The other problem is that for "1.0", the language itself is well known: it's pretty much what you see today. But "1.0" for the general tooling? Now that's a harder question. We have plans but since everything is being worked on as we go (mostly volunteers), we cannot say when things will be finished. The biggest project at the moment is `core:os/os2`, the replacement for the `core:os` package. `core:os` was the first package ever written for Odin and it's absolutely dreadful and needs replacing. And that's what we've been doing with `core:os/os2`, slowly. And when it is ready, we will tell people many months in advance when we will make it the official one. This will be a breaking change, but probably the last biggest one for Odin.
LexiMax 1y ago
I feel like the lack of marketing push is for two reasons. One is that it feels like Odin simply doesn't desire the kind of attention the other two languages have. Two is...I can't speak for Rust, but I feel like Zig punches well above its weight because of comptime, privileged support for Result <T, E> in the form of error unions, and having a realistic roadmap for porting C code thanks to translate-c and its build system. From what little I've seen of Odin, it doesn't have anything in particular that's especially headline-grabbing. However, Odin does have one thing that Zig doesn't, and it's that the language is considered "complete" despite its git repository being newer than Zig by a year. When it comes to programming languages, I do feel like there's something to be said for ease-of-implementation, and although Zig _feels_ simple from a feature-set point of view, I imagine it has a much higher bar to clear in terms of implementation complexity.
johnisgood 1y ago
They have a Discord server.

by ksec 1y ago

gingerBill 1y ago

So Odin the language in-itself is effectively done. But of course the core library, vendor library, tooling, etc are still very much being improved. The reason for the lack of "social media presence" is because Odin is kind of weird to market for: https://www.gingerbill.org/article/2024/09/08/odin-weird-to-market/ https://www.gingerbill.org/article/2024/09/08/odin-weird-to-... It's not "hypeable" like Zig or Rust mainly because it doesn't have any "killer features" but rather is a very pragmatic language by design. The people Odin attracts are also not the types of people to evangelize Odin either, since they are not there for the hype-train but to actually program. So if you can help us find a way to market Odin itself without lying or exaggerating or overblowing minor features, then that would be very much obliged. It's a lot harder than you think. As for "1.0", we have never worked to a timeframe for anything nor any sort of roadmap. The reason being is that we do not want to give false promises/hope about anything. Roadmaps are purely for advertisement, and the problem is, we don't even work to one so why present one? The other problem is that for "1.0", the language itself is well known: it's pretty much what you see today. But "1.0" for the general tooling? Now that's a harder question. We have plans but since everything is being worked on as we go (mostly volunteers), we cannot say when things will be finished. The biggest project at the moment is `core:os/os2`, the replacement for the `core:os` package. `core:os` was the first package ever written for Odin and it's absolutely dreadful and needs replacing. And that's what we've been doing with `core:os/os2`, slowly. And when it is ready, we will tell people many months in advance when we will make it the official one. This will be a breaking change, but probably the last biggest one for Odin.

LexiMax 1y ago

I feel like the lack of marketing push is for two reasons. One is that it feels like Odin simply doesn't desire the kind of attention the other two languages have. Two is...I can't speak for Rust, but I feel like Zig punches well above its weight because of comptime, privileged support for Result <T, E> in the form of error unions, and having a realistic roadmap for porting C code thanks to translate-c and its build system. From what little I've seen of Odin, it doesn't have anything in particular that's especially headline-grabbing. However, Odin does have one thing that Zig doesn't, and it's that the language is considered "complete" despite its git repository being newer than Zig by a year. When it comes to programming languages, I do feel like there's something to be said for ease-of-implementation, and although Zig _feels_ simple from a feature-set point of view, I imagine it has a much higher bar to clear in terms of implementation complexity.

johnisgood 1y ago

They have a Discord server.