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Had the Democratic Party's nomination won the election the worst outcomes of the second Trump presidency would have been prevented. You can blame the campaign a

by chrchr 1y ago

Had the Democratic Party's nomination won the election the worst outcomes of the second Trump presidency would have been prevented. You can blame the campaign and the primary voters and the party or whatever, but ultimately the general election voters could have chosen a normal politician who would have at least been a competent, law-abiding administrator and instead voters chose this. The two party system and the lack of ranked-choice voting are no excuse.

AnthonyMouse 1y ago
The Democratic Party nominated a poor candidate who proceeded to lose the election. Because there are only two viable parties, that means the other party wins, even when the other party nominated Donald Trump. If you use a cardinal voting system (note: not ranked-choice voting), there are more than two viable candidates, and then putting Donald Trump and Kamala Harris on the ballet only causes them both to lose because they're both undesirable candidates and less undesirable candidates would score higher with the voters than either of them. And then you don't get Donald Trump. (Or Kamala Harris.)
- chrchr 1y ago
  I don't know what third candidate you think could have beaten both Trump and Harris in a three way race. "Someone else" is always a popular choice until the someone else turns out to be RFK Jr. or Vivek Ramaswamy or Kanye West. And that's beside the point. Voters had a choice between Harris, who would have been a capable defender of the health research funding that the article discusses, and Trump. They chose Trump. That was a bad choice and it was clearly a bad choice at the time. If the general election is between Pinochet and Marco Rubio you can bet I'll vote for Marco Rubio.
  - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
    > I don't know what third candidate you think could have beaten both Trump and Harris in a three way race. "Someone else" is always a popular choice until the someone else turns out to be RFK Jr. or Vivek Ramaswamy or Kanye West. Under the existing system, a three way race between Trump, Harris and Marco Rubio causes Harris to win because Trump and Rubio split the Republican vote. So the Republicans, in order to prevent this, only run one candidate. When that candidate is Trump and the Democrats choose Harris, oops. Score voting is the thing they use in the Olympics. Voters rate every candidate on a scale of 1 to 10, highest average wins. Now if you add Rubio to the ballot, it only affects Trump's chances to the extent that Rubio could score higher than Trump. So there are no more primaries, every party just runs all their candidates in the general election. Meanwhile Rubio will score higher than Trump among Democrats and not much if at all lower among Republicans, so Rubio defeats Trump. And if you put some Democrat the likes of Jared Polis on a general election ballot, he plausibly scores higher than Harris. If you had to flip a coin between Jared Polis and Marco Rubio, how is that not better than it being Harris and Trump?
    - hn_acker 1y ago
      > If you had to flip a coin between Jared Polis and Marco Rubio, how is that not better than it being Harris and Trump? Without detracting from your explanation about score voting, I would hope that Jared Polis will recalibrate his judgement about other people's medical opinions prior to running for president [1]: > He has supported Donald Trump's decision to nominate Robert F. Kennedy Jr. as the secretary of Health and Human Services.[114] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Polis#Vaccines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Polis#Vaccines
- exe34 1y ago
  > The Democratic Party nominated a poor candidate who proceeded to lose the election. Because there are only two viable parties, that means the other party wins, even when the other party nominated Donald Trump. You had a choice between Trump again and not Trump. You can't keep blaming others for your choices.
  - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - CamperBob2 1y ago
      voting for a total unknown who can't even answer basic policy questions is absurd Voting for a mediagenic con man who also can't answer basic policy questions is even more absurd, but never mind that.
      - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
        No, Trump will answer questions and do media interviews, and the specific way in which he lies about things is consistent and predictable. Most of what he's doing are the things he said he was going to do. The problem is he said he was going to do a lot of asinine stuff, like promote coal. Which is bad because it's a bad policy, not because you had no idea he intended to do it. But it still seems like people should be able to agree that being forced to choose between two bad candidates is a problem worth solving.
    - exe34 1y ago
      > You had a choice between a giant douche and a turd sandwich So you described Trump, but I don't see the problem with Kamala? Isn't "the same" better than "worse"?
      - mhb 1y ago
        Kamala is clearly an idiot. So there's that. Who are you trying to convince? It would be great if the Democrats could learn that all it would take to beat the giant douche is to run someone reasonably intelligent and moderate instead of playing the brinksmanship game believing that it's unthinkable that anyone would actually vote for the giant douche.

by chrchr 1y ago

AnthonyMouse 1y ago

The Democratic Party nominated a poor candidate who proceeded to lose the election. Because there are only two viable parties, that means the other party wins, even when the other party nominated Donald Trump. If you use a cardinal voting system (note: not ranked-choice voting), there are more than two viable candidates, and then putting Donald Trump and Kamala Harris on the ballet only causes them both to lose because they're both undesirable candidates and less undesirable candidates would score higher with the voters than either of them. And then you don't get Donald Trump. (Or Kamala Harris.)

chrchr 1y ago
I don't know what third candidate you think could have beaten both Trump and Harris in a three way race. "Someone else" is always a popular choice until the someone else turns out to be RFK Jr. or Vivek Ramaswamy or Kanye West. And that's beside the point. Voters had a choice between Harris, who would have been a capable defender of the health research funding that the article discusses, and Trump. They chose Trump. That was a bad choice and it was clearly a bad choice at the time. If the general election is between Pinochet and Marco Rubio you can bet I'll vote for Marco Rubio.
- AnthonyMouse 1y ago
  > I don't know what third candidate you think could have beaten both Trump and Harris in a three way race. "Someone else" is always a popular choice until the someone else turns out to be RFK Jr. or Vivek Ramaswamy or Kanye West. Under the existing system, a three way race between Trump, Harris and Marco Rubio causes Harris to win because Trump and Rubio split the Republican vote. So the Republicans, in order to prevent this, only run one candidate. When that candidate is Trump and the Democrats choose Harris, oops. Score voting is the thing they use in the Olympics. Voters rate every candidate on a scale of 1 to 10, highest average wins. Now if you add Rubio to the ballot, it only affects Trump's chances to the extent that Rubio could score higher than Trump. So there are no more primaries, every party just runs all their candidates in the general election. Meanwhile Rubio will score higher than Trump among Democrats and not much if at all lower among Republicans, so Rubio defeats Trump. And if you put some Democrat the likes of Jared Polis on a general election ballot, he plausibly scores higher than Harris. If you had to flip a coin between Jared Polis and Marco Rubio, how is that not better than it being Harris and Trump?
  - hn_acker 1y ago
    > If you had to flip a coin between Jared Polis and Marco Rubio, how is that not better than it being Harris and Trump? Without detracting from your explanation about score voting, I would hope that Jared Polis will recalibrate his judgement about other people's medical opinions prior to running for president [1]: > He has supported Donald Trump's decision to nominate Robert F. Kennedy Jr. as the secretary of Health and Human Services.[114] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Polis#Vaccines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jared_Polis#Vaccines
exe34 1y ago
> The Democratic Party nominated a poor candidate who proceeded to lose the election. Because there are only two viable parties, that means the other party wins, even when the other party nominated Donald Trump. You had a choice between Trump again and not Trump. You can't keep blaming others for your choices.
- AnthonyMouse 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - CamperBob2 1y ago
    voting for a total unknown who can't even answer basic policy questions is absurd Voting for a mediagenic con man who also can't answer basic policy questions is even more absurd, but never mind that.
    - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
      No, Trump will answer questions and do media interviews, and the specific way in which he lies about things is consistent and predictable. Most of what he's doing are the things he said he was going to do. The problem is he said he was going to do a lot of asinine stuff, like promote coal. Which is bad because it's a bad policy, not because you had no idea he intended to do it. But it still seems like people should be able to agree that being forced to choose between two bad candidates is a problem worth solving.
  - exe34 1y ago
    > You had a choice between a giant douche and a turd sandwich So you described Trump, but I don't see the problem with Kamala? Isn't "the same" better than "worse"?
    - mhb 1y ago
      Kamala is clearly an idiot. So there's that. Who are you trying to convince? It would be great if the Democrats could learn that all it would take to beat the giant douche is to run someone reasonably intelligent and moderate instead of playing the brinksmanship game believing that it's unthinkable that anyone would actually vote for the giant douche.