4 ms·

Society should provide everyone with minimum food/shelter/health/education ... paid for by?

ricardobeat 14y ago
By everyone. It's 2012, we have plenty of food and materials to provide for every human being, it's just a matter of distribution.
_delirium 14y ago
In the case of Denmark, taxes. The idea is that in a Western country with a reasonably high standard of living, it's possible to shift the playing field on which individuals compete so that it takes place between, say [$20k,inf] rather than [$0,inf]. The tradeoff is some percentage taken off the upside in return for a cap on the downside. Seems reasonably fair to me, and I don't mind paying taxes for that safety net to exist. One can make all sorts of arguments about exactly where to set the thresholds, but the American attitude that seems to be a kind of visceral anger baffles me. As someone well into the middle class, I don't feel some kind of moral indignation that I could be making 10% more money if only there wasn't this healthcare and housing for poor people.
- theorique 14y ago
  Yeah, that's pretty much the point I was getting at - the price for "everyone should get [...]" comes from somewhere, and that somewhere is usually taxes.
  - osdf 14y ago
    How a BIG may be financed can not be answered like this. You probably don't speak german, otherwise you may find this interview (and link to his doctoral thesis) interesting: http://www.forum-grundeinkommen.de/filme/andre-presse/doktorarbeit-finanzierung-grundeinkommens-andre-presse http://www.forum-grundeinkommen.de/filme/andre-presse/doktor... What it says is basically that for a BIG of 800 Euro (per month per person) in Germany there are only 20 billion Euro's missing (per year), that's nothing compared to e.g. what's currently spent for banks and other fancy things without blinking an eye (or in other words: our society is already working with such a high productivity that a BIG is already possible) The tax system (and social welfare system) needs to be changed completely, but the level of taxation will stay the same.

By everyone. It's 2012, we have plenty of food and materials to provide for every human being, it's just a matter of distribution.

_delirium 14y ago

In the case of Denmark, taxes. The idea is that in a Western country with a reasonably high standard of living, it's possible to shift the playing field on which individuals compete so that it takes place between, say [$20k,inf] rather than [$0,inf]. The tradeoff is some percentage taken off the upside in return for a cap on the downside. Seems reasonably fair to me, and I don't mind paying taxes for that safety net to exist. One can make all sorts of arguments about exactly where to set the thresholds, but the American attitude that seems to be a kind of visceral anger baffles me. As someone well into the middle class, I don't feel some kind of moral indignation that I could be making 10% more money if only there wasn't this healthcare and housing for poor people.

theorique 14y ago
Yeah, that's pretty much the point I was getting at - the price for "everyone should get [...]" comes from somewhere, and that somewhere is usually taxes.
- osdf 14y ago
  How a BIG may be financed can not be answered like this. You probably don't speak german, otherwise you may find this interview (and link to his doctoral thesis) interesting: http://www.forum-grundeinkommen.de/filme/andre-presse/doktorarbeit-finanzierung-grundeinkommens-andre-presse http://www.forum-grundeinkommen.de/filme/andre-presse/doktor... What it says is basically that for a BIG of 800 Euro (per month per person) in Germany there are only 20 billion Euro's missing (per year), that's nothing compared to e.g. what's currently spent for banks and other fancy things without blinking an eye (or in other words: our society is already working with such a high productivity that a BIG is already possible) The tax system (and social welfare system) needs to be changed completely, but the level of taxation will stay the same.