3 ms·

Congrats on your non-retirement! My personal Cloudflare pro/con list: + Keeps the web working at scale + Made me a lot of money in the stock market - It's s

by lysace 1y ago

Congrats on your non-retirement! My personal Cloudflare pro/con list: + Keeps the web working at scale + Made me a lot of money in the stock market - It's so very high-touch/sales-intensive. I want a tiered public price list that is universally adhered to. Otherwise there's always that nagging feeling that I'm getting screwed for not being aggressive enough, or something. I know I'm fighting an uphill battle here. See also this documentary about Jared Dunn/Ed Chambers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-CA2EW4Z_U https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-CA2EW4Z_U

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
jsheard 1y ago
> Keeps the web working at scale OTOH they also keep DDoS providers working at scale. Look for "stressers" or "booters" and check their DNS, 9 times out of 10 the attackers which Cloudflare offers to protect you from are themselves hiding behind Cloudflare.
- tclancy 1y ago
  Somebody gotta sell shovels baby. And this feels unfair to expect a company to differentiate black vs white hats at scale, having tried to do the same at only an order or two of lower magnitude.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- lysace 1y ago
  Yes, the hosting policy seems to be a bit random and mostly based on what eastdakota/Matthew Prince decides. That's also a con/minus.
- ipdashc 1y ago
  This gets thrown around a bunch, but it always seemed like kind of an odd complaint to me? They're not actually pushing the DDoS traffic itself through cloudflare's network, or operating the botnet through it, are they? My assumption was that when people say this, they're referring to the webpage where you can buy the DDoS providers' services. And for that, I mean, is it really a big deal that it's behind cloudflare? There are plenty of similar reverse proxy services, I assume they just used cloudflare because it's reliable and cheap (and as people in the business, they probably know that it's effective). Would it make a big difference if they didn't use a proxy- are people going to start ddosing the ddos providers?
  - jsheard 1y ago
    > Would it make a big difference if they didn't use a proxy- are people going to start ddosing the ddos providers? Well yeah, the DDoS providers are strongly incentivized to fire all of their spare capacity at each other to thin out the competition. It's just futile to do so when nearly every player in the game is fronted by one of the biggest DDoS mitigation services in the world, which consistently turns a blind eye.

by lysace 1y ago

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

jsheard 1y ago

> Keeps the web working at scale OTOH they also keep DDoS providers working at scale. Look for "stressers" or "booters" and check their DNS, 9 times out of 10 the attackers which Cloudflare offers to protect you from are themselves hiding behind Cloudflare.

tclancy 1y ago
Somebody gotta sell shovels baby. And this feels unfair to expect a company to differentiate black vs white hats at scale, having tried to do the same at only an order or two of lower magnitude.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
lysace 1y ago
Yes, the hosting policy seems to be a bit random and mostly based on what eastdakota/Matthew Prince decides. That's also a con/minus.
ipdashc 1y ago
This gets thrown around a bunch, but it always seemed like kind of an odd complaint to me? They're not actually pushing the DDoS traffic itself through cloudflare's network, or operating the botnet through it, are they? My assumption was that when people say this, they're referring to the webpage where you can buy the DDoS providers' services. And for that, I mean, is it really a big deal that it's behind cloudflare? There are plenty of similar reverse proxy services, I assume they just used cloudflare because it's reliable and cheap (and as people in the business, they probably know that it's effective). Would it make a big difference if they didn't use a proxy- are people going to start ddosing the ddos providers?
- jsheard 1y ago
  > Would it make a big difference if they didn't use a proxy- are people going to start ddosing the ddos providers? Well yeah, the DDoS providers are strongly incentivized to fire all of their spare capacity at each other to thin out the competition. It's just futile to do so when nearly every player in the game is fronted by one of the biggest DDoS mitigation services in the world, which consistently turns a blind eye.