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The crate is 100% documented. what specific documentation do you think are lacking? Tutorials? That's for users to write. Calling iced not useful reads like an

The crate is 100% documented. what specific documentation do you think are lacking? Tutorials? That's for users to write. Calling iced not useful reads like an uninformed take

volkk 1y ago
> what specific documentation do you think are lacking? Tutorials? examples beyond tiny todo app/best practices would be a great start. > Tutorials? That's for users to write. sure, and how's that going for them? there are near zero tutorials out there, and as someone looking to build a desktop tool in rust, they've lost me. maybe i'm not important enough for them and their primary goal is to intellectually gatekeep this tool from the vast majority for a long time, in which case, mission accomplished
- airstrike 1y ago
  there are literally dozens of examples, including many apps you can reference. come join the discord and check out the showcase channel. I've written and published probably 50-100 examples to show best practices to people who want to learn more. I basically leave zero questions unanswered on that server, unless they are so far out of my wheelhouse that I can't answer them, but even then I might point you to the right resource or person...and I'm not even part of the team. the community is just wonderful IMHO > sure, and how's that going for them? there are near zero tutorials out there, and as someone looking to build a desktop tool in rust, they've lost me. maybe i'm not important enough for them and their primary goal is to intellectually gatekeep this tool from the vast majority for a long time, in which case, mission accomplished 26.5k stars on github and a flourishing community of users, which grows noticeably larger every day. new features basically every week. bug fixes sometimes fixed in literal minutes. it's not a matter of gatekeeping, but a matter of resources. iced is basically the brainchild of a single developer (plus core team members who tackle some bits and pieces of the codebase but not frequently), who already has a day time job and is doing this for free. would you rather him write documentation—which you and I could very well write—or keep adding features so the library can get to 1.0? I encourage you to look for evidence that invalidates your biases, as I'm confident you'll find it. and you might just love the library and the community. I promise you a warm welcome when you join us on discord ;-) here are a few examples of bigger apps you can reference: https://github.com/squidowl/halloy https://github.com/squidowl/halloy https://github.com/hecrj/icebreaker https://github.com/hecrj/icebreaker https://github.com/hecrj/holodeck https://github.com/hecrj/holodeck and my smaller-scale examples (I'm afraid my own big app is proprietary): https://github.com/airstrike/iced_receipts https://github.com/airstrike/iced_receipts a simple app showing how to manage multiple screens for CRUD-like flows https://github.com/airstrike/pathfinder/ https://github.com/airstrike/pathfinder/ a simple app showing how to draw on a canvas https://github.com/airstrike/iced_openai https://github.com/airstrike/iced_openai a barebones app showing how to make async requests https://github.com/airstrike/tabular https://github.com/airstrike/tabular a somewhat complex custom widget example
  - volkk 1y ago
    this is cool! i appreciate the warm invite. I really like your repo! They should include these examples in their primary repo. I did bump into halloy/icebreaker, etc but i just don't really find reading through massive repos a great entrypoint into whether a library/framework makes sense for me. I'll have to seriously look into it again, i do really like a vibrant community, and a lively discord is a nice close second. Thanks!
    - airstrike 1y ago
      glad to hear it and thanks for the kind words! I'll be waiting for you on Discord ;-) my username is the same there so ping me if you need anything and I forgot to link to a ridiculously cool new feature that dropped last week: time travel debugging for free https://github.com/iced-rs/iced/pull/2910 https://github.com/iced-rs/iced/pull/2910 check out the third and fourth videos!
      - volkk 1y ago
        wow that's actually quite awesome
  - stonogo 1y ago
    > iced is basically the brainchild of a single developer (plus core team members who tackle some bits and pieces of the codebase but not frequently), who already has a day time job and is doing this for free. This single-handedly convinced me not to rely on anything using Iced. I have no patience left for projects with that low a bus factor.
    - airstrike 1y ago
      Can't please everyone
Klonoar 1y ago
At some point you will need to realize that the endless people commenting about the lack of documentation is an issue with Iced, and the proverbial head in the sand approach will not help you. UI frameworks typically need more than just the type of documentation that Rust docs provide. We see this with just about every UI framework around. Just write some tutorials already.
- airstrike 1y ago
  I'm not a maintainer or a member of the project, just an interested user. Tutorials might be nice, but the library is evolving fast. I'm happier the core team spent time working on an animations API and debugging (including time travel) since the last release instead of working on guides for beginners. Maybe that changes after 1.0. Until then, countless users have learned to use it. Also iced is more a library than a framework. There's no right answer to the problems you'll be trying to solve, so writing guides on "best practices" is generally unhelpful if not downright harmful.
  - Klonoar 1y ago
    > Until then, countless users have learned to use it. And countless others have requested exactly what I'm saying here. Cuts both ways. > There's no right answer to the problems you'll be trying to solve There's no right answer in e.g AppKit or UIKit, but having actual guides for those ecosystems has been crucial for their uptake/usage over the past decade or so. UI frameworks and libraries are not like standard developer tools and need additional documentation.

The crate is 100% documented. what specific documentation do you think are lacking? Tutorials? That's for users to write. Calling iced not useful reads like an uninformed take

volkk 1y ago

> what specific documentation do you think are lacking? Tutorials? examples beyond tiny todo app/best practices would be a great start. > Tutorials? That's for users to write. sure, and how's that going for them? there are near zero tutorials out there, and as someone looking to build a desktop tool in rust, they've lost me. maybe i'm not important enough for them and their primary goal is to intellectually gatekeep this tool from the vast majority for a long time, in which case, mission accomplished

airstrike 1y ago
there are literally dozens of examples, including many apps you can reference. come join the discord and check out the showcase channel. I've written and published probably 50-100 examples to show best practices to people who want to learn more. I basically leave zero questions unanswered on that server, unless they are so far out of my wheelhouse that I can't answer them, but even then I might point you to the right resource or person...and I'm not even part of the team. the community is just wonderful IMHO > sure, and how's that going for them? there are near zero tutorials out there, and as someone looking to build a desktop tool in rust, they've lost me. maybe i'm not important enough for them and their primary goal is to intellectually gatekeep this tool from the vast majority for a long time, in which case, mission accomplished 26.5k stars on github and a flourishing community of users, which grows noticeably larger every day. new features basically every week. bug fixes sometimes fixed in literal minutes. it's not a matter of gatekeeping, but a matter of resources. iced is basically the brainchild of a single developer (plus core team members who tackle some bits and pieces of the codebase but not frequently), who already has a day time job and is doing this for free. would you rather him write documentation—which you and I could very well write—or keep adding features so the library can get to 1.0? I encourage you to look for evidence that invalidates your biases, as I'm confident you'll find it. and you might just love the library and the community. I promise you a warm welcome when you join us on discord ;-) here are a few examples of bigger apps you can reference: https://github.com/squidowl/halloy https://github.com/squidowl/halloy https://github.com/hecrj/icebreaker https://github.com/hecrj/icebreaker https://github.com/hecrj/holodeck https://github.com/hecrj/holodeck and my smaller-scale examples (I'm afraid my own big app is proprietary): https://github.com/airstrike/iced_receipts https://github.com/airstrike/iced_receipts a simple app showing how to manage multiple screens for CRUD-like flows https://github.com/airstrike/pathfinder/ https://github.com/airstrike/pathfinder/ a simple app showing how to draw on a canvas https://github.com/airstrike/iced_openai https://github.com/airstrike/iced_openai a barebones app showing how to make async requests https://github.com/airstrike/tabular https://github.com/airstrike/tabular a somewhat complex custom widget example
- volkk 1y ago
  this is cool! i appreciate the warm invite. I really like your repo! They should include these examples in their primary repo. I did bump into halloy/icebreaker, etc but i just don't really find reading through massive repos a great entrypoint into whether a library/framework makes sense for me. I'll have to seriously look into it again, i do really like a vibrant community, and a lively discord is a nice close second. Thanks!
  - airstrike 1y ago
    glad to hear it and thanks for the kind words! I'll be waiting for you on Discord ;-) my username is the same there so ping me if you need anything and I forgot to link to a ridiculously cool new feature that dropped last week: time travel debugging for free https://github.com/iced-rs/iced/pull/2910 https://github.com/iced-rs/iced/pull/2910 check out the third and fourth videos!
    - volkk 1y ago
      wow that's actually quite awesome
- stonogo 1y ago
  > iced is basically the brainchild of a single developer (plus core team members who tackle some bits and pieces of the codebase but not frequently), who already has a day time job and is doing this for free. This single-handedly convinced me not to rely on anything using Iced. I have no patience left for projects with that low a bus factor.
  - airstrike 1y ago
    Can't please everyone

Klonoar 1y ago

At some point you will need to realize that the endless people commenting about the lack of documentation is an issue with Iced, and the proverbial head in the sand approach will not help you. UI frameworks typically need more than just the type of documentation that Rust docs provide. We see this with just about every UI framework around. Just write some tutorials already.

airstrike 1y ago
I'm not a maintainer or a member of the project, just an interested user. Tutorials might be nice, but the library is evolving fast. I'm happier the core team spent time working on an animations API and debugging (including time travel) since the last release instead of working on guides for beginners. Maybe that changes after 1.0. Until then, countless users have learned to use it. Also iced is more a library than a framework. There's no right answer to the problems you'll be trying to solve, so writing guides on "best practices" is generally unhelpful if not downright harmful.
- Klonoar 1y ago
  > Until then, countless users have learned to use it. And countless others have requested exactly what I'm saying here. Cuts both ways. > There's no right answer to the problems you'll be trying to solve There's no right answer in e.g AppKit or UIKit, but having actual guides for those ecosystems has been crucial for their uptake/usage over the past decade or so. UI frameworks and libraries are not like standard developer tools and need additional documentation.