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> Progress of technology should not be artitrarily held back to protect automateable jobs though. We need to adapt. So you don't mind if your economic value dr

> Progress of technology should not be artitrarily held back to protect automateable jobs though. We need to adapt. So you don't mind if your economic value drops to zero, with all human labour replaced by machines? Dependent on UBI, existing in a basic pod, eating rations of slop.

cik 1y ago
> So you don't mind if your economic value drops to zero, with all human labour replaced by machines? This was the fear when the cotton gin was invented. It was the ear when cars were created. The same complaint happened with the introduction of electronic, automated, telephone switchboards. Jobs change. Societies change. Unemployment worldwide, is near the lowest it has ever been. Work will change. Society will eventually move to a currency based on energy production, or something equally futuristic. This doesn't mean that getting there will be without pain.
- voidspark 1y ago
  The goal for AGI/ASI is to create machines that can do any job much faster, better, and cheaper than humans. That's the ultimate end point of this progress. The economic value of human labour will drop to zero. That would be an existential threat to our civilization.
- achierius 1y ago
  Where did all the work-horses go? Why is there barely a fraction of the population there once was? Why did they not adapt and find niches where they had a competitive advantage over cars and machines?
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - wickedsight 1y ago
    The horses weren't the market the economy is selling to, the people are. Ford figured out that people having both time and money is best for the economy. We'll figure out that having all the production capabilities but none of the market benefits nobody.
TobTobXX 1y ago
Yes! Sounds like a dream. My value isn't determined by some economic system, but rather by myself. There is so much to do when you don't have to work. Of course, this assumes we actually get to UBI first, and it doesn't create widespread poverty. But even if humanity will have to go through widespread poverty, we'd porbably come out with UBI on the other side (minus a few hundred millions starved). There's so much to do, explore and learn. The prospect of AI stealing my job is only scary because my income depends on this job.
- voidspark 1y ago
  > There's so much to do, explore and learn. Hobbies, hanging out with friends, reading, etc. That's basically it. Probably no international travel. It will be like a simple retirement on a low income, because in a socialist system the resources must be rationed. This will drive a lot of young ambitious people to insanity. Nothing meaningful for them to achieve. No purpose. Drug use, debauchery, depression, violence, degeneracy, gangs. It will be a true idiocracy. No Darwinian selection pressures, unless the system enforces eugenics and population control.
  - pixelbro 1y ago
    Wait, wait, wait. Our society's gonna fall apart due to a lack of Darwinian selection pressure? What do you think we're selecting for right now? Seems to me like our culture treats both survival and reproduction as an inalienable right. Most people would go so far as to say everyone deserves love, "there's a lid for every pot".
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
  - knowaveragejoe 1y ago
    > This will drive a lot of young ambitious people to insanity. Nothing meaningful for them to achieve. Maybe, if the only flavor of ambition you're aware of is that of SV types. Plenty of people have found achievement and meaning before and alongside the digital revolution world.

cik 1y ago

> So you don't mind if your economic value drops to zero, with all human labour replaced by machines? This was the fear when the cotton gin was invented. It was the ear when cars were created. The same complaint happened with the introduction of electronic, automated, telephone switchboards. Jobs change. Societies change. Unemployment worldwide, is near the lowest it has ever been. Work will change. Society will eventually move to a currency based on energy production, or something equally futuristic. This doesn't mean that getting there will be without pain.

voidspark 1y ago
The goal for AGI/ASI is to create machines that can do any job much faster, better, and cheaper than humans. That's the ultimate end point of this progress. The economic value of human labour will drop to zero. That would be an existential threat to our civilization.
achierius 1y ago
Where did all the work-horses go? Why is there barely a fraction of the population there once was? Why did they not adapt and find niches where they had a competitive advantage over cars and machines?
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- wickedsight 1y ago
  The horses weren't the market the economy is selling to, the people are. Ford figured out that people having both time and money is best for the economy. We'll figure out that having all the production capabilities but none of the market benefits nobody.

TobTobXX 1y ago

Yes! Sounds like a dream. My value isn't determined by some economic system, but rather by myself. There is so much to do when you don't have to work. Of course, this assumes we actually get to UBI first, and it doesn't create widespread poverty. But even if humanity will have to go through widespread poverty, we'd porbably come out with UBI on the other side (minus a few hundred millions starved). There's so much to do, explore and learn. The prospect of AI stealing my job is only scary because my income depends on this job.

voidspark 1y ago
> There's so much to do, explore and learn. Hobbies, hanging out with friends, reading, etc. That's basically it. Probably no international travel. It will be like a simple retirement on a low income, because in a socialist system the resources must be rationed. This will drive a lot of young ambitious people to insanity. Nothing meaningful for them to achieve. No purpose. Drug use, debauchery, depression, violence, degeneracy, gangs. It will be a true idiocracy. No Darwinian selection pressures, unless the system enforces eugenics and population control.
- pixelbro 1y ago
  Wait, wait, wait. Our society's gonna fall apart due to a lack of Darwinian selection pressure? What do you think we're selecting for right now? Seems to me like our culture treats both survival and reproduction as an inalienable right. Most people would go so far as to say everyone deserves love, "there's a lid for every pot".
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- knowaveragejoe 1y ago
  > This will drive a lot of young ambitious people to insanity. Nothing meaningful for them to achieve. Maybe, if the only flavor of ambition you're aware of is that of SV types. Plenty of people have found achievement and meaning before and alongside the digital revolution world.