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"One is the result of millenia of systematic oppression, while the other is the result of people refusing to get help for themselves even when it is offered for

by ajays 14y ago

"One is the result of millenia of systematic oppression, while the other is the result of people refusing to get help for themselves even when it is offered for free. " Have you wondered why so many of the homeless are people of color? I used to live in upstate New York. By chance I happened to venture into a local reservation. I was shocked to see the conditions they were living in; especially given the fact that the area gets pretty darn cold in the winter. Both of these groups (blacks, as well as native Americans) have been the victims of discrimination for centuries. But people don't waive this fact all over HN any time the topic of NASA comes up.

w1ntermute 14y ago
I don't deny that blacks and Native Americans have been treated poorly, and that they still face discrimination. However, that doesn't change the fact that those people you see on the street are there because they refuse the help they are given. San Francisco is one of the most liberal cities in the country. There are dozens of upper middle class yuppies pleading with the homeless to accept their help. > By chance I happened to venture into a local reservation. I was shocked to see the conditions they were living in; especially given the fact that the area gets pretty darn cold in the winter. Native American reservations are, by their own choice, given a high level of autonomy by the US government. Once again, these people have made a conscious decision to reject help given them. Every single one of these people has chosen to live on a reservation when they could benefit from everything that modern America has to offer. Now, I can see that on a macro level, what the immigrants did to the Native Americans must seem horribly unjust, and therefore their descendants don't exactly want to accept the US government's help. However, on an individual level, these are individuals who have a clear path to bettering their lives that they simply refuse. This is incomparable to the systematic suppression of millions upon millions of people that occurs to this very day, both on a macro and micro level, in India.
- ajays 14y ago
  You are really clueless, aren't you? The problems that you see on reservations are the direct result of centuries of oppression. It may look different to you than the situation in India, most likely because you're probably white and male, and hence belong to the side that's been oppressing; but the situation is the same. Systemic denial of equal rights, denial of services, forced segregation from the rest of the society .... fundamentally, it's the same. You may disagree, and I don't blame you; but having lived in India and the US for equal parts of my life, I see the same patterns.
  - w1ntermute 14y ago
    You're the one who seems to still be incapable of understanding what I'm saying. I don't deny that discrimination has occurred in US. I never have. The difference is that significant steps have been taken to combat discrimination in America, whereas there is a general apathy towards that in India (and most of the developing world). Trying to equate the two is completely nonsensical, as is trying to equate the level of poverty in America, even on a reservation, with that in India. > having lived in India and the US for equal parts of my life, I see the same patterns. As an Indian who has managed to make it to America, I don't think you're in any place to comment on what life is like for poor Indians, particularly those facing endemic caste-based discrimination. Their experiences are completely foreign to you, just as I wouldn't claim that I understand what African Americans or Native Americans go through.

by ajays 14y ago

w1ntermute 14y ago

I don't deny that blacks and Native Americans have been treated poorly, and that they still face discrimination. However, that doesn't change the fact that those people you see on the street are there because they refuse the help they are given. San Francisco is one of the most liberal cities in the country. There are dozens of upper middle class yuppies pleading with the homeless to accept their help. > By chance I happened to venture into a local reservation. I was shocked to see the conditions they were living in; especially given the fact that the area gets pretty darn cold in the winter. Native American reservations are, by their own choice, given a high level of autonomy by the US government. Once again, these people have made a conscious decision to reject help given them. Every single one of these people has chosen to live on a reservation when they could benefit from everything that modern America has to offer. Now, I can see that on a macro level, what the immigrants did to the Native Americans must seem horribly unjust, and therefore their descendants don't exactly want to accept the US government's help. However, on an individual level, these are individuals who have a clear path to bettering their lives that they simply refuse. This is incomparable to the systematic suppression of millions upon millions of people that occurs to this very day, both on a macro and micro level, in India.

ajays 14y ago
You are really clueless, aren't you? The problems that you see on reservations are the direct result of centuries of oppression. It may look different to you than the situation in India, most likely because you're probably white and male, and hence belong to the side that's been oppressing; but the situation is the same. Systemic denial of equal rights, denial of services, forced segregation from the rest of the society .... fundamentally, it's the same. You may disagree, and I don't blame you; but having lived in India and the US for equal parts of my life, I see the same patterns.
- w1ntermute 14y ago
  You're the one who seems to still be incapable of understanding what I'm saying. I don't deny that discrimination has occurred in US. I never have. The difference is that significant steps have been taken to combat discrimination in America, whereas there is a general apathy towards that in India (and most of the developing world). Trying to equate the two is completely nonsensical, as is trying to equate the level of poverty in America, even on a reservation, with that in India. > having lived in India and the US for equal parts of my life, I see the same patterns. As an Indian who has managed to make it to America, I don't think you're in any place to comment on what life is like for poor Indians, particularly those facing endemic caste-based discrimination. Their experiences are completely foreign to you, just as I wouldn't claim that I understand what African Americans or Native Americans go through.