6 ms·

How Kim Jong Il Kidnapped a Director, Made a Cult Hit Godzilla Knockoff (2015)

73 points by bschne 1y ago

roydivision 1y ago
Paul Fischer's book, 'A Kim Jong-Il Production' is well worth a read, not only for the story of these kidnappings, but of life in North Korea and its history.
domoregood 1y ago
Story is from 2015, but here's the readable link anyhow: https://archive.is/ldZDX https://archive.is/ldZDX
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
ivape 1y ago
Why did they have to resort to kidnapping though? There's so many people that will do anything for money. I must be missing something about North Korea.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > I must be missing something about North Korea Sanctions.
  - Rendello 1y ago
    Though interestingly: > though Kim despised the Japanese, he set aside his pride and flew in the special-effects team of the original films, along with Kenpachiro Satsuma, the man inside the Godzilla suit. According to Satsuma, he and his crew members thought they had been hired for a film shooting in China when they landed in North Korea instead. The production and release sections of the Wikipedia article are interesting. It was intended for wide release by a Japanese company, then banned by the NK government after the director fled. In the 90s it saw a wide release, even in South Korea. The then-escaped director tried to sue it off the air. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari
  - calgarymicro 1y ago
    At the time this movie was being made I don't think NK was any more sanctioned than any other Eastern Bloc country, and plenty of other Eastern Bloc countries had little issue scraping together enough cash to pay westerners to do stuff
    - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
      > At the time this movie was being made I don't think NK was any more sanctioned than any other Eastern Bloc country The U.S. “imposed sanctions in the 1950s and tightened them further after international bombings against South Korea by North Korean agents during the 1980s” [1]. And by the 80s, savvy Eastern Bloc countries could read the writing on the wall. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_against_North_Korea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_agai...
      - calgarymicro 1y ago
        Nobody in the Eastern Bloc was trading with the US very much; I was thinking more about other countries. North Korea would have been relatively unfettered within the Eastern Bloc, for example, same as most communist nations. Also, the director was kidnapped in 1978, so before those sanctions were tightened down in the 80s and well before any Eastern Bloc states could see any writing on the wall. I'd be curious how those restrictions compared to those the US had on most other communist nations.
- rawgabbit 1y ago
  https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/testimony_of_kim_young_soon.pdf https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/testimony_of_kim_... Other political crimes that I came to know of after I was incarcerated in the prison camp. “The crime of talking about a cyst/lump on Kim Il Sung‟s neck.” “The crime of (unwittingly) damaging or soiling the statue or portrait of Kim Il Sung.” “The crime of knowing about the private life of Kim Jong-il. For example, knowing about Sung Hae Rim being the hidden mistress of Kim Jong-il, and disclosing this information to an outsider.” “The crime of revealing the birth of Kim Jong Nam, the firstborn son of Kim Jong-il” “The crime of listening to or viewing foreign radio or TV.” “The crime of questioning or criticizing the policy of the Worker‟s Party.” “The crime of expressing criticism or complaints about North Korea society.”
  - snkzxbs 1y ago
    I don’t think information about the NK regime posted on house.gov should be completely believed.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- cookiemonsieur 1y ago
  > I must be missing something about North Korea. Other than, irrational, comical western propaganda, not much no.
marc_abonce 1y ago
Just to clarify, the article is from 2015, but the actual movie is from 1985: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari
Rendello 1y ago
It's on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHV-UOdBek0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHV-UOdBek0
CameronBanga 1y ago
This is why the movie tariffs are a matter of national security.
romanhn 1y ago
Really curious what modern North Korean cinema is like, especially compared to the slick South Korean productions. One of my favorite childhood movies growing up in late 80s Soviet Union was Hong Kil Dong, a campy North Korean martial arts movie, with a folk hero battling evil ninjas. Played across Eastern European movie theaters. Rewatching it as an adult, I was surprised how little propaganda there was in it. According to Wikipedia, the creators were inspired by Shin Sang Ok, the kidnapped director (other sources say he was directly involved - https://youtu.be/lroqzeyPVs0?si=A8yh0hNl0-d2QGgR https://youtu.be/lroqzeyPVs0?si=A8yh0hNl0-d2QGgR).
- grakasja 1y ago
  "Who's that avenger with a flute? He's sticking up for poor people!"
- m000 1y ago
  > I was surprised how little propaganda there was in it. Compared to?
  - romanhn 1y ago
    Compared to what I would expect from North Korean media
jongjong 1y ago
It's actually quite profound, politically speaking. I understand why Kim Jong Il thought it was a Masterpiece. To get hung up on visuals and call it a knockoff is itself tacky and shows a lack of appreciation for context; which is what art is about. It's an honest take on modern human society and the tradeoffs that are made. It gives insights into the minds of some modern leaders... The idea that you have to kill the monster which saved you. The part at the very end where the woman kills the monster and sacrifices herself with it (out of principle) is brilliant. At the end, the soul of the monster joins with the body of the woman and the camera zooms in on her face... You assume that it will bring her back to life but actually, she is not moving and you can't quite tell if her eyes are open or closed (dead or alive)? There's something deep behind the ambiguity. I suspect Kim Jong Il saw the monster as a metaphor for capitalism or globalization, the woman as a metaphor for a revolutionary leader (maybe Kim himself) and the monster's relentless hunger for metals as a metaphor for greed-driven industrialization but I wonder to what extent did he see it as a metaphor for his own communist movement? The message seems to be that even though she did a bad thing killing their saviour, she did it with sound morals because she was willing to sacrifice herself. She knew it was the right thing to do to contain the monster's relentless greed. But I feel like the part at the very end where the soul of the monster joins her body is a way to show that she is forgiven because it's the intent that counts... Maybe a subtle hint that a good leader is rewarded for having good intentions and conviction but is it purely an ideological reward of being spiritually 'made whole' or also material (she gets to live)? It makes me wonder if Kim Jong Il may have been tempted to turn North Korea into a capitalist society under the thumb of globalists; keep feeding the beast which had originally (in his view) freed his people from past oppression but instead, he decided to politically 'sacrifice himself' for his people by betraying that globalist monster which had helped him. There is a statement at the end which essentially amounts to blasphemy in the west: "To keep feeding him, we will have to keep sending him to other countries to wage war. We cannot do this to the world." Ouch. As unfree and poor as North Korea may be, this is an incredibly blunt, honest take.
- lwo32k 1y ago
  More like people have limitations and there are complex problems they can't solve because of those limitations. Therefore any attempt creates new problems. So they make up Stories to justify their actions and shift focus away from the costs. Some people buy the stories. Some people don't. Because with complex problems its like the Universe is in Superposition. The wave function can't collapse. Stability is maintained through incoherence. Tale as old time. Older you get there are better things to do than spend time watching people attempt things way above their pay grade.
emmelaich 1y ago
Full movie on youtube. This moment where baby monster bites a sword is epic: https://youtu.be/MHV-UOdBek0?t=1647 https://youtu.be/MHV-UOdBek0?t=1647
aussieguy1234 1y ago
For anyone concerned about accidentally hiring a fake NK remote worker, just ask if Kim Jong Un is fat during the interview. Typically, they will end the call immediately.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
grakasja 1y ago
It's actually debated whether the director was "kidnapped". Lots of people in Korea believe he went willingly. His left-wing films had been banned in the South, and Kim Jong-il offered him superstardom, big budgets and creative control. North Korea was not as bad back then, relatively speaking. Its economy still enjoyed support from both China and the USSR and it could trade with the entire Eastern bloc. South Korea was also a dictatorial military regime at the time (didn't get democracy until 1980s), and lots of South Koreans and Koreans in Japan actually moved to the North in the 60s and 70s. Shin was also generously allowed to "escape" with his family at a film festival after he and Kim ran into creative differences. On another note Pulgasari is an interesting film because it contains a coded criticism of the Kim regime at the end.
- rat87 1y ago
  This seems incredibly unlikely https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abduction_of_Shin_Sang-ok_and_Choi_Eun-hee https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abduction_of_Shin_Sang-ok_an... > To defend themselves should they ever escape North Korea, Choi and Shin decided to sneak in a tape recorder to their conversations with Kim Jong Il so they would have proof that they did not willingly leave the South. In one conversation recorded on October 19, 1983, Kim spoke openly about his plot to kidnap Shin and Choi to upgrade North Korea's film industry. He told Shin and Choi that it would be best if they spoke to the press saying that they came to North Korea voluntarily.[3] Shin and Choi attended a press conference on April 12, 1984, in Belgrade, Yugoslavia where they said they were in North Korea by their own choosing.
  - grakasja 1y ago
    Their re-defection in Vienna seems extremely unlikely. The tape doesn't actually say that they were kidnapped from Hong Kong, that's the summary of a Wikipedia editor. Shin later said that if he had been blocked from making films in the 60s he would have gone to the North voluntarily. We only have his version of the story after he left NK, and the NK government version which are both going to be biased. The truth could be somewhere in the middle e.g. he was lured for a visit or talks and then kept against his will when he changed his mind.
ultrasandwich 1y ago
A friend of mine created a graphic novel about this, called "Madame Choi and the Monsters", if you're interested in that kind of thing. https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/madame-choi-and-the-monsters_9781914224225/ https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/madame-choi-and-the-mons...

73 points by bschne 1y ago

Paul Fischer's book, 'A Kim Jong-Il Production' is well worth a read, not only for the story of these kidnappings, but of life in North Korea and its history.

domoregood 1y ago

Story is from 2015, but here's the readable link anyhow: https://archive.is/ldZDX https://archive.is/ldZDX

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

ivape 1y ago

Why did they have to resort to kidnapping though? There's so many people that will do anything for money. I must be missing something about North Korea.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> I must be missing something about North Korea Sanctions.
- Rendello 1y ago
  Though interestingly: > though Kim despised the Japanese, he set aside his pride and flew in the special-effects team of the original films, along with Kenpachiro Satsuma, the man inside the Godzilla suit. According to Satsuma, he and his crew members thought they had been hired for a film shooting in China when they landed in North Korea instead. The production and release sections of the Wikipedia article are interesting. It was intended for wide release by a Japanese company, then banned by the NK government after the director fled. In the 90s it saw a wide release, even in South Korea. The then-escaped director tried to sue it off the air. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari
- calgarymicro 1y ago
  At the time this movie was being made I don't think NK was any more sanctioned than any other Eastern Bloc country, and plenty of other Eastern Bloc countries had little issue scraping together enough cash to pay westerners to do stuff
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > At the time this movie was being made I don't think NK was any more sanctioned than any other Eastern Bloc country The U.S. “imposed sanctions in the 1950s and tightened them further after international bombings against South Korea by North Korean agents during the 1980s” [1]. And by the 80s, savvy Eastern Bloc countries could read the writing on the wall. [1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_against_North_Korea https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_agai...
    - calgarymicro 1y ago
      Nobody in the Eastern Bloc was trading with the US very much; I was thinking more about other countries. North Korea would have been relatively unfettered within the Eastern Bloc, for example, same as most communist nations. Also, the director was kidnapped in 1978, so before those sanctions were tightened down in the 80s and well before any Eastern Bloc states could see any writing on the wall. I'd be curious how those restrictions compared to those the US had on most other communist nations.
rawgabbit 1y ago
https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/testimony_of_kim_young_soon.pdf https://chrissmith.house.gov/uploadedfiles/testimony_of_kim_... Other political crimes that I came to know of after I was incarcerated in the prison camp. “The crime of talking about a cyst/lump on Kim Il Sung‟s neck.” “The crime of (unwittingly) damaging or soiling the statue or portrait of Kim Il Sung.” “The crime of knowing about the private life of Kim Jong-il. For example, knowing about Sung Hae Rim being the hidden mistress of Kim Jong-il, and disclosing this information to an outsider.” “The crime of revealing the birth of Kim Jong Nam, the firstborn son of Kim Jong-il” “The crime of listening to or viewing foreign radio or TV.” “The crime of questioning or criticizing the policy of the Worker‟s Party.” “The crime of expressing criticism or complaints about North Korea society.”
- snkzxbs 1y ago
  I don’t think information about the NK regime posted on house.gov should be completely believed.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
cookiemonsieur 1y ago
> I must be missing something about North Korea. Other than, irrational, comical western propaganda, not much no.

marc_abonce 1y ago

Just to clarify, the article is from 2015, but the actual movie is from 1985: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulgasari

Rendello 1y ago

It's on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHV-UOdBek0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHV-UOdBek0

CameronBanga 1y ago

This is why the movie tariffs are a matter of national security.

romanhn 1y ago

Really curious what modern North Korean cinema is like, especially compared to the slick South Korean productions. One of my favorite childhood movies growing up in late 80s Soviet Union was Hong Kil Dong, a campy North Korean martial arts movie, with a folk hero battling evil ninjas. Played across Eastern European movie theaters. Rewatching it as an adult, I was surprised how little propaganda there was in it. According to Wikipedia, the creators were inspired by Shin Sang Ok, the kidnapped director (other sources say he was directly involved - https://youtu.be/lroqzeyPVs0?si=A8yh0hNl0-d2QGgR https://youtu.be/lroqzeyPVs0?si=A8yh0hNl0-d2QGgR).

grakasja 1y ago
"Who's that avenger with a flute? He's sticking up for poor people!"
m000 1y ago
> I was surprised how little propaganda there was in it. Compared to?
- romanhn 1y ago
  Compared to what I would expect from North Korean media

jongjong 1y ago

It's actually quite profound, politically speaking. I understand why Kim Jong Il thought it was a Masterpiece. To get hung up on visuals and call it a knockoff is itself tacky and shows a lack of appreciation for context; which is what art is about. It's an honest take on modern human society and the tradeoffs that are made. It gives insights into the minds of some modern leaders... The idea that you have to kill the monster which saved you. The part at the very end where the woman kills the monster and sacrifices herself with it (out of principle) is brilliant. At the end, the soul of the monster joins with the body of the woman and the camera zooms in on her face... You assume that it will bring her back to life but actually, she is not moving and you can't quite tell if her eyes are open or closed (dead or alive)? There's something deep behind the ambiguity. I suspect Kim Jong Il saw the monster as a metaphor for capitalism or globalization, the woman as a metaphor for a revolutionary leader (maybe Kim himself) and the monster's relentless hunger for metals as a metaphor for greed-driven industrialization but I wonder to what extent did he see it as a metaphor for his own communist movement? The message seems to be that even though she did a bad thing killing their saviour, she did it with sound morals because she was willing to sacrifice herself. She knew it was the right thing to do to contain the monster's relentless greed. But I feel like the part at the very end where the soul of the monster joins her body is a way to show that she is forgiven because it's the intent that counts... Maybe a subtle hint that a good leader is rewarded for having good intentions and conviction but is it purely an ideological reward of being spiritually 'made whole' or also material (she gets to live)? It makes me wonder if Kim Jong Il may have been tempted to turn North Korea into a capitalist society under the thumb of globalists; keep feeding the beast which had originally (in his view) freed his people from past oppression but instead, he decided to politically 'sacrifice himself' for his people by betraying that globalist monster which had helped him. There is a statement at the end which essentially amounts to blasphemy in the west: "To keep feeding him, we will have to keep sending him to other countries to wage war. We cannot do this to the world." Ouch. As unfree and poor as North Korea may be, this is an incredibly blunt, honest take.

lwo32k 1y ago
More like people have limitations and there are complex problems they can't solve because of those limitations. Therefore any attempt creates new problems. So they make up Stories to justify their actions and shift focus away from the costs. Some people buy the stories. Some people don't. Because with complex problems its like the Universe is in Superposition. The wave function can't collapse. Stability is maintained through incoherence. Tale as old time. Older you get there are better things to do than spend time watching people attempt things way above their pay grade.

emmelaich 1y ago

Full movie on youtube. This moment where baby monster bites a sword is epic: https://youtu.be/MHV-UOdBek0?t=1647 https://youtu.be/MHV-UOdBek0?t=1647

aussieguy1234 1y ago

For anyone concerned about accidentally hiring a fake NK remote worker, just ask if Kim Jong Un is fat during the interview. Typically, they will end the call immediately.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]

grakasja 1y ago

It's actually debated whether the director was "kidnapped". Lots of people in Korea believe he went willingly. His left-wing films had been banned in the South, and Kim Jong-il offered him superstardom, big budgets and creative control. North Korea was not as bad back then, relatively speaking. Its economy still enjoyed support from both China and the USSR and it could trade with the entire Eastern bloc. South Korea was also a dictatorial military regime at the time (didn't get democracy until 1980s), and lots of South Koreans and Koreans in Japan actually moved to the North in the 60s and 70s. Shin was also generously allowed to "escape" with his family at a film festival after he and Kim ran into creative differences. On another note Pulgasari is an interesting film because it contains a coded criticism of the Kim regime at the end.

rat87 1y ago
This seems incredibly unlikely https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abduction_of_Shin_Sang-ok_and_Choi_Eun-hee https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abduction_of_Shin_Sang-ok_an... > To defend themselves should they ever escape North Korea, Choi and Shin decided to sneak in a tape recorder to their conversations with Kim Jong Il so they would have proof that they did not willingly leave the South. In one conversation recorded on October 19, 1983, Kim spoke openly about his plot to kidnap Shin and Choi to upgrade North Korea's film industry. He told Shin and Choi that it would be best if they spoke to the press saying that they came to North Korea voluntarily.[3] Shin and Choi attended a press conference on April 12, 1984, in Belgrade, Yugoslavia where they said they were in North Korea by their own choosing.
- grakasja 1y ago
  Their re-defection in Vienna seems extremely unlikely. The tape doesn't actually say that they were kidnapped from Hong Kong, that's the summary of a Wikipedia editor. Shin later said that if he had been blocked from making films in the 60s he would have gone to the North voluntarily. We only have his version of the story after he left NK, and the NK government version which are both going to be biased. The truth could be somewhere in the middle e.g. he was lured for a visit or talks and then kept against his will when he changed his mind.

ultrasandwich 1y ago

A friend of mine created a graphic novel about this, called "Madame Choi and the Monsters", if you're interested in that kind of thing. https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/madame-choi-and-the-monsters_9781914224225/ https://www.abramsbooks.com/product/madame-choi-and-the-mons...