3 ms·

It would be pretty stereotypically Soviet to create a parachute system that only mostly (some of the Venera probes kinda crashed) works in the intended use case

It would be pretty stereotypically Soviet to create a parachute system that only mostly (some of the Venera probes kinda crashed) works in the intended use case (short 1-way trip to Venus) but also somehow manages to work once way, way, way outside of its intended operating environment (50yr orbiting earth).

0x000xca0xfe 2y ago
To be fair Venus' atmosphere is pretty much hell.
- BitwiseFool 2y ago
  Higher up the Venusian atmosphere is surprisingly earth-like. Interestingly though, once a probe gets deep enough into the atmosphere a parachute becomes unnecessary because the atmosphere has gotten so thick that a probe can simply soft-land.
varjag 2y ago
Parachute deployment was possibly gasodynamic rather than electronically controlled. In which case there's a broad similarity on reentry in Earth atmosphere which could trigger the release.
- orbital-decay 2y ago
  Sounds unlikely, but it could have malfunctioned. I believe the deceleration chute was designed to deploy after the hot entry phase and be triggered mechanically once crossing the certain deceleration threshold of about 2g (I could be wrong though, take it with a huge grain of salt). It also worked as a pilot chute for the cap protecting the main one.
mrtksn 2y ago
In my experience, in soviet engineering they don't augment stuff unless absolutely necessary. As a result, stuff tend to work as long as the physics work. It results in relatively crude but simple and reliable machines. The elegance comes from simplicity, in western tech the elegance comes from being well thought and designed for specific use cases. I.e. a Lada will be uncomfortable, loud, uneconomical car but at the same time it will withstand abuse and be easy to repair enough to get it going. Thinking about the elevator in our commie block, it would have given a heart attack to a western European. Instead of having double doors to keep us safe from the moving wall, it had pads on the bottom and top edge so if your hand or leg is stuck, the pad will be pushed and the elevator will stop immediately. Also there was a tiny cabinet door on the right side so you can access the mechanism to force open the door or force move/halt the elevator. As kids, we would be experimenting with those mechanisms. They worked every single time, no legs or arms were lost.
- throwewey 2y ago
  A Lada is actually an Italian car built under license. Neah, paternoster is quite a common elevator design in the west: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternoster_lift https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternoster_lift
  - mrtksn 2y ago
    Depends on the model. It's Lada Niva that is legendary.
    - throwewey 2y ago
      How could I forget! Many apologies.
    - fipar 2y ago
      I often see one parked in my area (in Uruguay) with a sticker that says “Land Rover recovery vehicle”
  - 725686 2y ago
    "The name paternoster ("Our Father", the first two words of the Lord's Prayer in Latin) was originally applied to the device because the elevator is in the form of a loop and is thus similar to rosary beads used as an aid in reciting prayers." I would have thought the name was related to the users praying before entering to increase their chances of surviving the ordeal.
    - tialaramex 2y ago
      Although this mechanism looks scary it's actually fine. The reason even its proponents accept you wouldn't build these now is that they have terrible accessibility, so they're only practical as an extra option.
      - em-bee 2y ago
        despite that, it looks like the reason no new paternosters are built and existing ones are removed is safety. unfortunately this is considered to be more important than cultural heritage protection. i have used one at the university of vienna. sadly it was removed almost 20 years ago.

0x000xca0xfe 2y ago

To be fair Venus' atmosphere is pretty much hell.

BitwiseFool 2y ago
Higher up the Venusian atmosphere is surprisingly earth-like. Interestingly though, once a probe gets deep enough into the atmosphere a parachute becomes unnecessary because the atmosphere has gotten so thick that a probe can simply soft-land.

varjag 2y ago

Parachute deployment was possibly gasodynamic rather than electronically controlled. In which case there's a broad similarity on reentry in Earth atmosphere which could trigger the release.

orbital-decay 2y ago
Sounds unlikely, but it could have malfunctioned. I believe the deceleration chute was designed to deploy after the hot entry phase and be triggered mechanically once crossing the certain deceleration threshold of about 2g (I could be wrong though, take it with a huge grain of salt). It also worked as a pilot chute for the cap protecting the main one.

mrtksn 2y ago

In my experience, in soviet engineering they don't augment stuff unless absolutely necessary. As a result, stuff tend to work as long as the physics work. It results in relatively crude but simple and reliable machines. The elegance comes from simplicity, in western tech the elegance comes from being well thought and designed for specific use cases. I.e. a Lada will be uncomfortable, loud, uneconomical car but at the same time it will withstand abuse and be easy to repair enough to get it going. Thinking about the elevator in our commie block, it would have given a heart attack to a western European. Instead of having double doors to keep us safe from the moving wall, it had pads on the bottom and top edge so if your hand or leg is stuck, the pad will be pushed and the elevator will stop immediately. Also there was a tiny cabinet door on the right side so you can access the mechanism to force open the door or force move/halt the elevator. As kids, we would be experimenting with those mechanisms. They worked every single time, no legs or arms were lost.

throwewey 2y ago
A Lada is actually an Italian car built under license. Neah, paternoster is quite a common elevator design in the west: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternoster_lift https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paternoster_lift
- mrtksn 2y ago
  Depends on the model. It's Lada Niva that is legendary.
  - throwewey 2y ago
    How could I forget! Many apologies.
  - fipar 2y ago
    I often see one parked in my area (in Uruguay) with a sticker that says “Land Rover recovery vehicle”
- 725686 2y ago
  "The name paternoster ("Our Father", the first two words of the Lord's Prayer in Latin) was originally applied to the device because the elevator is in the form of a loop and is thus similar to rosary beads used as an aid in reciting prayers." I would have thought the name was related to the users praying before entering to increase their chances of surviving the ordeal.
  - tialaramex 2y ago
    Although this mechanism looks scary it's actually fine. The reason even its proponents accept you wouldn't build these now is that they have terrible accessibility, so they're only practical as an extra option.
    - em-bee 2y ago
      despite that, it looks like the reason no new paternosters are built and existing ones are removed is safety. unfortunately this is considered to be more important than cultural heritage protection. i have used one at the university of vienna. sadly it was removed almost 20 years ago.