4 ms·

They are not pushed by the media though. Men and women are attracted to what they are attracted to. We instinctively know if someone is attractive to us. Its ea

They are not pushed by the media though. Men and women are attracted to what they are attracted to. We instinctively know if someone is attractive to us. Its easy to say person A is more attractive than person B. Thinner and more in shape people are more attractive than obese people. This is just a fact of life, no one is to blame for it.

DougN7 1y ago
If anything it’s genetics at play attempting to produce the healthiest offspring.
grafmax 1y ago
Standards of attractiveness vary significantly across cultures, so a simplistic biological perspective is misguided. It’s reasonable to argue that attraction is instinctive, but only if we acknowledge that our understanding of those instincts is shaped by cultural influences - including mass media.
- wonderwonder 1y ago
  That hot girl in the club is going to be a hot girl in the club, regardless of the club being located in New York, Tel Aviv, Dubai or Nairobi No need to over complicate things
  - grafmax 1y ago
    That’s modern globalized cultural, which doesn’t really represent the expanse of human cultural diversity, and is heavily influenced by modern social and mass media. Think instead of examples such as lip plates, extreme fattening, crossed eyes, unibrows, tooth blackening - all features considered attractive in different cultures.
    - wonderwonder 1y ago
      Everything you have listed are niche fetishes with no widespread acceptance in society. Again, the hot girl in the club is going to be considered hot by most of the people practicing these fetishes as well. This is akin to me saying women on average are shorter than men and you retorting with "I know a tall woman"
      - grafmax 1y ago
        Those are all examples taken from actual cultures not fetishes. Unibrow: Tajikistan Crossed eyes: ancient Mayan culture Teeth blackening: Ohaguro etc Our modern globalized culture only gives us a tiny taste of what cultural diversity really is. That is because cultural diversity is actually erased by globalization - a process really begun by colonization, really the earliest form of globalization.
        wonderwonder 1y ago
        Who cares? The Mayans are dead. Civilizations rise and fall. Today we all agree what is attractive or not. The hot girl in the club is always attractive. I don’t care what the fringe likes. We don't have to celebrate or respect what other cultures found acceptable. The Aztecs sacrificed and ate children, the world was better off after they were gone. I don't have to respect their culture or what they found attractive or examine the nuances of why "actually their child sacrifices were ok" I'm going to confidently continue to find attractive what I find attractive and 95% of the world agrees with me. I celebrate the rise of the current global culture. I’ll leave it to you to lament the end of foot binding and blackened teeth.
        grafmax 1y ago
        My point was that culture does in fact inform our beauty standards. No reason to get defensive about it.
        wonderwonder 1y ago
        Sorry man, I've had DEI and empathy and "respect for other cultures" forced on me for so long that I unconsciously lash at out now. I hit the limit on it and its bled into other areas. Apologies for taking it out on you.
adonovan 1y ago
I think you underestimate your cultural bias. Being physically capable may seem like an objective basis for attraction, but at various times and places in history larger people have been considered more attractive than skinnier ones, perhaps because a richer diet signifies affluence. Remember that, relatively recently, having a suntan changed its connotation away from "farmer" and toward "world traveler".
- simmerup 1y ago
  I suspect those people would be considered merely overweight today. Characters like Henry VIII were pretty rare
Snow_Falls 1y ago
"This is just a fact of life, no one is to blame for it." Please remember that your culture affects your idea of normal immensley. There are large periods of history where europeans considered being overweight attractive, where being extremely pale was attractive rather than tan etc. Some cultures have even more extreme versions of this (foot binding, neck lengthening rings etc). Those people probably thought that their idea of beuaty was "just a fact of life" too.
- wonderwonder 1y ago
  I can almost guarantee you that any of those cultures (foot binding, neck lengthening rings etc) would absolutely agree that the hot girl at the club in NYC with her normal size neck and feet is indeed hot.

DougN7 1y ago

If anything it’s genetics at play attempting to produce the healthiest offspring.

grafmax 1y ago

Standards of attractiveness vary significantly across cultures, so a simplistic biological perspective is misguided. It’s reasonable to argue that attraction is instinctive, but only if we acknowledge that our understanding of those instincts is shaped by cultural influences - including mass media.

wonderwonder 1y ago
That hot girl in the club is going to be a hot girl in the club, regardless of the club being located in New York, Tel Aviv, Dubai or Nairobi No need to over complicate things
- grafmax 1y ago
  That’s modern globalized cultural, which doesn’t really represent the expanse of human cultural diversity, and is heavily influenced by modern social and mass media. Think instead of examples such as lip plates, extreme fattening, crossed eyes, unibrows, tooth blackening - all features considered attractive in different cultures.
  - wonderwonder 1y ago
    Everything you have listed are niche fetishes with no widespread acceptance in society. Again, the hot girl in the club is going to be considered hot by most of the people practicing these fetishes as well. This is akin to me saying women on average are shorter than men and you retorting with "I know a tall woman"
    - grafmax 1y ago
      Those are all examples taken from actual cultures not fetishes. Unibrow: Tajikistan Crossed eyes: ancient Mayan culture Teeth blackening: Ohaguro etc Our modern globalized culture only gives us a tiny taste of what cultural diversity really is. That is because cultural diversity is actually erased by globalization - a process really begun by colonization, really the earliest form of globalization.
      - wonderwonder 1y ago
        Who cares? The Mayans are dead. Civilizations rise and fall. Today we all agree what is attractive or not. The hot girl in the club is always attractive. I don’t care what the fringe likes. We don't have to celebrate or respect what other cultures found acceptable. The Aztecs sacrificed and ate children, the world was better off after they were gone. I don't have to respect their culture or what they found attractive or examine the nuances of why "actually their child sacrifices were ok" I'm going to confidently continue to find attractive what I find attractive and 95% of the world agrees with me. I celebrate the rise of the current global culture. I’ll leave it to you to lament the end of foot binding and blackened teeth.
        grafmax 1y ago
        My point was that culture does in fact inform our beauty standards. No reason to get defensive about it.
        wonderwonder 1y ago
        Sorry man, I've had DEI and empathy and "respect for other cultures" forced on me for so long that I unconsciously lash at out now. I hit the limit on it and its bled into other areas. Apologies for taking it out on you.

adonovan 1y ago

I think you underestimate your cultural bias. Being physically capable may seem like an objective basis for attraction, but at various times and places in history larger people have been considered more attractive than skinnier ones, perhaps because a richer diet signifies affluence. Remember that, relatively recently, having a suntan changed its connotation away from "farmer" and toward "world traveler".

simmerup 1y ago
I suspect those people would be considered merely overweight today. Characters like Henry VIII were pretty rare

Snow_Falls 1y ago

"This is just a fact of life, no one is to blame for it." Please remember that your culture affects your idea of normal immensley. There are large periods of history where europeans considered being overweight attractive, where being extremely pale was attractive rather than tan etc. Some cultures have even more extreme versions of this (foot binding, neck lengthening rings etc). Those people probably thought that their idea of beuaty was "just a fact of life" too.

wonderwonder 1y ago
I can almost guarantee you that any of those cultures (foot binding, neck lengthening rings etc) would absolutely agree that the hot girl at the club in NYC with her normal size neck and feet is indeed hot.