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>there is a perception among many of lower socioeconomic status I don't think this is it at all. In the US we don't enforce social norms. The public transit ex

>there is a perception among many of lower socioeconomic status I don't think this is it at all. In the US we don't enforce social norms. The public transit experience in the US is dominated by an extreme antisocial minority ("crazy" bums, drug users, bluetooth speakers, etc). This is the true killer of public transit in America.

kube-system 1y ago
Those things keeps the middle class from using it (outside of a couple of cities) or from voting for more public transit -- but it isn't the reason that poor people are driving without license/insurance -- which was what I was commenting on. Many of the poor in this country live in places that aren't well served by public transit, and probably won't be well served by any marginal investment in public transit. Most places in the US are generations behind in the investment that would need to be made both in terms of transit infrastructure and the housing infrastructure that would be necessary for viable public transit for the poor. Suburban sprawl is a huge challenge.
matheusmoreira 1y ago
It's the killer of public transit everywhere. The ability to avoid such people is a huge benefit of individual transportation. Nobody sane wants to be subjected to stuff like that. Anyone saying otherwise is virtue signalling.
- afavour 1y ago
  I’d argue not everywhere, it just requires a critical mass of “normal” (anti-anti-social?) people to use it. Like in NYC. Most assuredly there are anti social people on the subway but they’re a tiny minority of overall passengers so people still use the system. But it’s a self-reinforcing thing that has danger of collapse, the more people drop off the more the ratio will change… and more will drop off.
- const_cast 1y ago
  In many places it's just not a big enough problem. And, either way, it's a perception issue usually. I mean yeah, subway homeless people make you feel unsafe. But you're not actually unsafe. Just by taking the subway you're a few orders of magnitude less likely to die during your journey.
  - ahmeneeroe-v2 1y ago
    I never felt "unsafe", but as soon as I could afford to drive to work, I chose that.
    - pas 1y ago
      was it convenience?

kube-system 1y ago

Those things keeps the middle class from using it (outside of a couple of cities) or from voting for more public transit -- but it isn't the reason that poor people are driving without license/insurance -- which was what I was commenting on. Many of the poor in this country live in places that aren't well served by public transit, and probably won't be well served by any marginal investment in public transit. Most places in the US are generations behind in the investment that would need to be made both in terms of transit infrastructure and the housing infrastructure that would be necessary for viable public transit for the poor. Suburban sprawl is a huge challenge.

matheusmoreira 1y ago

It's the killer of public transit everywhere. The ability to avoid such people is a huge benefit of individual transportation. Nobody sane wants to be subjected to stuff like that. Anyone saying otherwise is virtue signalling.

afavour 1y ago
I’d argue not everywhere, it just requires a critical mass of “normal” (anti-anti-social?) people to use it. Like in NYC. Most assuredly there are anti social people on the subway but they’re a tiny minority of overall passengers so people still use the system. But it’s a self-reinforcing thing that has danger of collapse, the more people drop off the more the ratio will change… and more will drop off.
const_cast 1y ago
In many places it's just not a big enough problem. And, either way, it's a perception issue usually. I mean yeah, subway homeless people make you feel unsafe. But you're not actually unsafe. Just by taking the subway you're a few orders of magnitude less likely to die during your journey.
- ahmeneeroe-v2 1y ago
  I never felt "unsafe", but as soon as I could afford to drive to work, I chose that.
  - pas 1y ago
    was it convenience?