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> and offer access through its own Walmart app. 8-( I've _never_ been required to "join the club", or "run the app" to purchase gasoline. Why does charging a

by johnea 2y ago

> and offer access through its own Walmart app. 8-( I've _never_ been required to "join the club", or "run the app" to purchase gasoline. Why does charging an EV require use of an app? This is an accessibility issue and as such should be illegal...

mayneack 2y ago
It definitely sucks, but it seems likely that gas stations would require it if they were invented today.
- autoexec 2y ago
  I doubt they'd get away with it. If they thought they could they'd already have done it, but it'd probably result in a lot of legislation and companies don't want regulation. The only reason Walmart can get away with it is that very few people have an electric car.
vel0city 2y ago
> Why does charging an EV require use of an app? It doesn't. Almost all DC fast charging I've done has been plug and charge or with a normal credit card terminal. Meanwhile when I buy gas at QT or Sam's Club I pay through an app.
- johnea 2y ago
  First 2 steps on Walmart's instruction page: * Donwload the Walmart app * Scan the QR code
  - vel0city 2y ago
    So Walmart's chargers require it. But EVs can charge at places other than Walmart. So a valid response to "Why does charging an EV require use of an app" is, it doesn't, other places don't require it.
    - johnea 2y ago
      The article is about Walmart chargers 8-/ Even aside from that, many charging networks _do_ require "membership", "running the app", and often even require a pre-established balance on the account for the most convenient charging process. It seems Walmart is also planning to follow this strategy, which is the point of the original objection.
      - vel0city 2y ago
        Your comment wasn't scoped to only Walmart chargers. It was scoped to "EV charging", which often doesn't require an app. As mentioned, the vast majority of my public DCFC experiences haven't used an app at all.
      - dzhiurgis 2y ago
        Add to tourism gatekeeping checklist - a verified US phone number or local bank account (popular in Europe). Oh and the "app is not available in your country".
- iwanttocomment 2y ago
  I've driven EVs since 2013 across several states and I've never once encountered a functioning public charging station in the US that has a credit card reader and does not require payment and/or access via an app. I'm all in favor of it, and I understand they technically exist, but perhaps your specific locality requires that? It's in no way my experience.
  - fullstop 2y ago
    There's an EVGo station near me which works with a credit card reader. Since my car supports plug and charge on that network, I used that.
  - vel0city 2y ago
    I've driven EVs in the US across several states since 2021 and I've run across several dozen DCFC that accepted nothing but a credit card reader.
    - iwanttocomment 2y ago
      You should consider yourself a lucky individual who has had a very different experience than many of us longtime EV drivers have had. (I should note that I have occasionally encountered charging stations that had integrated credit card readers, but they have all been out of service.)
      - floxy 2y ago
        Electrify America doesn't require you to use an app in the Pacific Northwest. You can just pay with a credit card.
kposehn 2y ago
I think the app will be for plug-and-charge users, while they'll have credit card readers for everyone else. I do agree that chargers requiring an app are a royal pain. We're an all-EV household and I don't bother with local chargers that don't have readers or support plug-and-charge. There's a lot of Shell chargers in our area that require an app to work and almost no-one uses them because of how clunky it is.
- vel0city 2y ago
  The article says the app is the primary way to activate the charger (scan a QR code on the dispenser) while they'll have credit card terminals for states that require it.
  - alostpuppy 2y ago
    This is how it works at Sam’s club gas fwiw
- tzs 2y ago
  It will likely work for Walmart because as of 2021 the Walmart app had 120 million active monthly users [1]. That's almost half of the US adult population. For all of those people, using the chargers won't require downloading some new clunky app that they only have because of EV charging. It will be that an app they already have and use regularly and already have their payment information adds EV charging to the list of Walmart goods and services that they already use it for. [1] https://www.appsrhino.com/blogs/walmart-grocery-delivery-app-statistics https://www.appsrhino.com/blogs/walmart-grocery-delivery-app...
  - natch 2y ago
    I don’t know how people get these ideas. Teslas do not need any app for charging. I mean sure, they do have an app, but no need to even have the app on the phone or with you to charge. No need for a phone or a credit card or a code or a password or a chip or a retina scan or interacting with a screen or tapping a keypad or anything. Just plug the plug into the car at the supercharger and it charges. Or, do it at home, cheaper.
formerly_proven 2y ago
US-specific issue
- Lio 2y ago
  Is it? I think it's a problem in the UK too. Every charging network seems to have its own associated app. Planning long journeys means having an app for every stop. It really shouldn't.
  - formerly_proven 2y ago
    Yeah, basically every public charger in the continental EU is going to be on the intercharge network.
    - Lio 2y ago
      I'd love it if that's now true, has there been some change in this? Last time I looked into it InterCharge (OICP) was still just 1 of 4 competing protocols along with OCPI, OCHP and eMIP. Has OICP displaced the others now or are they still fighting it out?
      - formerly_proven 2y ago
        I don't know and I don't think an EV driver has to care. Maybe it's not all intercharge, maybe there are more networks in the background. The salient point is the consumer perspective: I can have one generic app to handle charging payments for basically any public charge point and I interact the same way with all of them, I put the plug in my car and scan a QR code. The debate in that unified market is more about price discrimination, because prices at a given charge point may vary depending on who operates it versus who your e-mobility provider is. Which is quite annoying in itself and should be fixed. But paying 59 ct/kWh vs. 69 ct/kWh is quite different from having a dedicated "car charging apps" folder on your phone.
  - dzhiurgis 2y ago
    0 accessibility and government happily funds these companies.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
Aurornis 2y ago
The app says that credit card access will be available in the future “at least” in states that require it. > This is an accessibility issue and as such should be illegal... Assuming it was app-exclusive, you would have a hard time convincing anyone that someone might be capable of driving an EV on the road while also having enough of a disability to make it impossible for them to use a phone app. There are already members-only gas stations such as the ones attached to Costco. This would be following the same pattern but with an app instead of a card, which is actually far more easy to acquire than a paid Costco membership.
- snypher 2y ago
  They could be dyslexic or something?
- mixmastamyk 2y ago
  Not what they mean. Card doesn't need power, screen, OS, BigTech approval, etc. Cash requires even less.
  - Aurornis 2y ago
    > Cash requires even less. EV charging stations that take cash are not going to be common. Card or app allow unattended use. Cash does not.
    - mixmastamyk 2y ago
      Not common currently. Gas stations with mini-marts figured this out decades ago.
kevin_thibedeau 2y ago
Vulture capitalists want to know where you live and your income level so they can sell your profile on to other data brokers. Cash is practically a communist plot to give people freedom and liberty.

by johnea 2y ago

mayneack 2y ago

It definitely sucks, but it seems likely that gas stations would require it if they were invented today.

autoexec 2y ago
I doubt they'd get away with it. If they thought they could they'd already have done it, but it'd probably result in a lot of legislation and companies don't want regulation. The only reason Walmart can get away with it is that very few people have an electric car.

vel0city 2y ago

> Why does charging an EV require use of an app? It doesn't. Almost all DC fast charging I've done has been plug and charge or with a normal credit card terminal. Meanwhile when I buy gas at QT or Sam's Club I pay through an app.

johnea 2y ago
First 2 steps on Walmart's instruction page: * Donwload the Walmart app * Scan the QR code
- vel0city 2y ago
  So Walmart's chargers require it. But EVs can charge at places other than Walmart. So a valid response to "Why does charging an EV require use of an app" is, it doesn't, other places don't require it.
  - johnea 2y ago
    The article is about Walmart chargers 8-/ Even aside from that, many charging networks _do_ require "membership", "running the app", and often even require a pre-established balance on the account for the most convenient charging process. It seems Walmart is also planning to follow this strategy, which is the point of the original objection.
    - vel0city 2y ago
      Your comment wasn't scoped to only Walmart chargers. It was scoped to "EV charging", which often doesn't require an app. As mentioned, the vast majority of my public DCFC experiences haven't used an app at all.
    - dzhiurgis 2y ago
      Add to tourism gatekeeping checklist - a verified US phone number or local bank account (popular in Europe). Oh and the "app is not available in your country".
iwanttocomment 2y ago
I've driven EVs since 2013 across several states and I've never once encountered a functioning public charging station in the US that has a credit card reader and does not require payment and/or access via an app. I'm all in favor of it, and I understand they technically exist, but perhaps your specific locality requires that? It's in no way my experience.
- fullstop 2y ago
  There's an EVGo station near me which works with a credit card reader. Since my car supports plug and charge on that network, I used that.
- vel0city 2y ago
  I've driven EVs in the US across several states since 2021 and I've run across several dozen DCFC that accepted nothing but a credit card reader.
  - iwanttocomment 2y ago
    You should consider yourself a lucky individual who has had a very different experience than many of us longtime EV drivers have had. (I should note that I have occasionally encountered charging stations that had integrated credit card readers, but they have all been out of service.)
    - floxy 2y ago
      Electrify America doesn't require you to use an app in the Pacific Northwest. You can just pay with a credit card.

kposehn 2y ago

I think the app will be for plug-and-charge users, while they'll have credit card readers for everyone else. I do agree that chargers requiring an app are a royal pain. We're an all-EV household and I don't bother with local chargers that don't have readers or support plug-and-charge. There's a lot of Shell chargers in our area that require an app to work and almost no-one uses them because of how clunky it is.

vel0city 2y ago
The article says the app is the primary way to activate the charger (scan a QR code on the dispenser) while they'll have credit card terminals for states that require it.
- alostpuppy 2y ago
  This is how it works at Sam’s club gas fwiw
tzs 2y ago
It will likely work for Walmart because as of 2021 the Walmart app had 120 million active monthly users [1]. That's almost half of the US adult population. For all of those people, using the chargers won't require downloading some new clunky app that they only have because of EV charging. It will be that an app they already have and use regularly and already have their payment information adds EV charging to the list of Walmart goods and services that they already use it for. [1] https://www.appsrhino.com/blogs/walmart-grocery-delivery-app-statistics https://www.appsrhino.com/blogs/walmart-grocery-delivery-app...
- natch 2y ago
  I don’t know how people get these ideas. Teslas do not need any app for charging. I mean sure, they do have an app, but no need to even have the app on the phone or with you to charge. No need for a phone or a credit card or a code or a password or a chip or a retina scan or interacting with a screen or tapping a keypad or anything. Just plug the plug into the car at the supercharger and it charges. Or, do it at home, cheaper.

formerly_proven 2y ago

US-specific issue

Lio 2y ago
Is it? I think it's a problem in the UK too. Every charging network seems to have its own associated app. Planning long journeys means having an app for every stop. It really shouldn't.
- formerly_proven 2y ago
  Yeah, basically every public charger in the continental EU is going to be on the intercharge network.
  - Lio 2y ago
    I'd love it if that's now true, has there been some change in this? Last time I looked into it InterCharge (OICP) was still just 1 of 4 competing protocols along with OCPI, OCHP and eMIP. Has OICP displaced the others now or are they still fighting it out?
    - formerly_proven 2y ago
      I don't know and I don't think an EV driver has to care. Maybe it's not all intercharge, maybe there are more networks in the background. The salient point is the consumer perspective: I can have one generic app to handle charging payments for basically any public charge point and I interact the same way with all of them, I put the plug in my car and scan a QR code. The debate in that unified market is more about price discrimination, because prices at a given charge point may vary depending on who operates it versus who your e-mobility provider is. Which is quite annoying in itself and should be fixed. But paying 59 ct/kWh vs. 69 ct/kWh is quite different from having a dedicated "car charging apps" folder on your phone.
- dzhiurgis 2y ago
  0 accessibility and government happily funds these companies.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

Aurornis 2y ago

The app says that credit card access will be available in the future “at least” in states that require it. > This is an accessibility issue and as such should be illegal... Assuming it was app-exclusive, you would have a hard time convincing anyone that someone might be capable of driving an EV on the road while also having enough of a disability to make it impossible for them to use a phone app. There are already members-only gas stations such as the ones attached to Costco. This would be following the same pattern but with an app instead of a card, which is actually far more easy to acquire than a paid Costco membership.

snypher 2y ago
They could be dyslexic or something?
mixmastamyk 2y ago
Not what they mean. Card doesn't need power, screen, OS, BigTech approval, etc. Cash requires even less.
- Aurornis 2y ago
  > Cash requires even less. EV charging stations that take cash are not going to be common. Card or app allow unattended use. Cash does not.
  - mixmastamyk 2y ago
    Not common currently. Gas stations with mini-marts figured this out decades ago.

kevin_thibedeau 2y ago

Vulture capitalists want to know where you live and your income level so they can sell your profile on to other data brokers. Cash is practically a communist plot to give people freedom and liberty.