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>> What is a close friend? Before we can start asking people if they have any we should probably agree on a definition. If you use the Hollywood standard, then

>> What is a close friend? Before we can start asking people if they have any we should probably agree on a definition. If you use the Hollywood standard, then probably none of us have close friends. I've come to this same conclusion, but rarely express it because it's possible I'm just different. And I'd even go one step further, I think what a lot of people say friendship is, isn't actually what human friendship is in practice. I think these unrealistic expectations undermine real-world friendships because they always fall short. Theoretical friendship: - Completely perfect and devoid of all realities of life - No jealousy, no competition, no negative feelings - Timeless and immortal - No effort involved - Completely balanced and healthy for everybody at all times - Able to talk about every topic Realistic friendship: - Temporary at first, may or may not build into something more - Often starts with a simple exchange of banter on common interests - Multiple opinions/topics that are mutually avoided - One person often tries harder, one person often values the relationship more - The relationship may or may not even be mutually healthy - Many will hit a point where they become more effort than they're worth and end (e.g. moving) - Some will never grow out of one or two common things to bitch about

closewith 1y ago
These don't represent real or Hollywood friendships at all. > - Completely perfect and devoid of all realities of life Friendships are relationships that stand the test of time and hardship. You work through problems, illnesses including mental health struggles, deaths, employment and money problems, family and relationship problems, legal problems, all sorts. > - No jealousy, no competition, no negative feelings There are obviously always mixed emotions, but generally you won't harbour serious ill will towards your friends. This is something you can work on, though, as jealousy and envy are personality traits that can be controlled. Healthy competition is a positive, though. > - Timeless and immortal Friendships change and sometimes have to be ended, even when you like the other person. I think this is quite common and almost a trope of Hollywood movies. > - No effort involved Short of family and maybe employment, friendships require the most work in life. This one is particularly baffling from a Hollywood perspective, as going a friend in need is like the all-time Hollywood trope. > - Completely balanced and healthy for everybody at all times Obviously this isn't true, but this isn't portrayed either. Flawed characters are the only compelling characters in Hollywood. > - Able to talk about every topic Again, changing the uncomfortable topic trope is an ultra-trope. Your "realistic friendship" section fits acquaintances rather than friends. >I think these unrealistic expectations undermine real-world friendships because they always fall short. I think some self-reflection is in order here, as this is projection.
- zug_zug 1y ago
  I don't know, that seems like a rather defensive response to me. Perhaps self-reflection is in order. Is the idea that friendship might be transactional too scary a thought to consider head on? Here's some science on the topic that is food for thought: https://www.thecut.com/2016/05/half-of-your-friends-probably-dont-think-of-you-as-a-friend.html https://www.thecut.com/2016/05/half-of-your-friends-probably...
  - closewith 1y ago
    > Is the idea that friendship might be transactional too scary a thought to consider head on? Rather than be defensive, it was designed to shock you out of your current thought patterns on friendship, because they are almost delusional. Neither movie idealised friends nor real-life friendships have any of the characteristics you describe, and that is distorting your view of the world. Pretending real friendship is a Hollywood myth is self-selecting yourself out of one of the most rewarding aspects of life. Don't do it to yourself. > The study authors gave a survey to 84 college students in the same class, Come on, time to get offline and go make some friends.
    - zug_zug 1y ago
      > Come on, time to get offline and go make some friends. Oof, I really struck a nerve huh? I'm sure you're smart enough to know you shouldn't try to hurt people's feelings just because they believe and idea that you don't believe.
      - closewith 1y ago
        > Oof, I really struck a nerve huh? No, you're misreading the tone here. It's more gentle paternal nudging. Don't let confirmation bias mislead you into a lonely life, especially not based on a study on somecollege students. I know it's more comforting to believe real friendships exist only in fiction rather than admit you haven't experienced it, but in the long run, this belief only hurts you.
subpixel 1y ago
I don’t disagree but I do have a friendship that matches your theoretical definition and I appreciate how rare a thing it is.
Braxton1980 1y ago
>The relationship may or may not even be mutually healthy My best friend of 30 years now met me because I distributed warez in Junior High. He hung around because I had something useful and wanted to maintain a relationship with me. This grew into something more meaningful
msephton 1y ago
I have friends like the first set of criteria, and there's nothing Hollywood about them or me.
watwut 1y ago
I wonder whether you actually watch movies and modern series, because the ones I have seen dont have friendships like you describe in them. Friendships in movies are neither effortless nor healthy. They have conflicts and personality issues to create drama and comedy. Like, I don't know what it is that you watch in TV ... but what I watch is much different.

closewith 1y ago

These don't represent real or Hollywood friendships at all. > - Completely perfect and devoid of all realities of life Friendships are relationships that stand the test of time and hardship. You work through problems, illnesses including mental health struggles, deaths, employment and money problems, family and relationship problems, legal problems, all sorts. > - No jealousy, no competition, no negative feelings There are obviously always mixed emotions, but generally you won't harbour serious ill will towards your friends. This is something you can work on, though, as jealousy and envy are personality traits that can be controlled. Healthy competition is a positive, though. > - Timeless and immortal Friendships change and sometimes have to be ended, even when you like the other person. I think this is quite common and almost a trope of Hollywood movies. > - No effort involved Short of family and maybe employment, friendships require the most work in life. This one is particularly baffling from a Hollywood perspective, as going a friend in need is like the all-time Hollywood trope. > - Completely balanced and healthy for everybody at all times Obviously this isn't true, but this isn't portrayed either. Flawed characters are the only compelling characters in Hollywood. > - Able to talk about every topic Again, changing the uncomfortable topic trope is an ultra-trope. Your "realistic friendship" section fits acquaintances rather than friends. >I think these unrealistic expectations undermine real-world friendships because they always fall short. I think some self-reflection is in order here, as this is projection.

zug_zug 1y ago
I don't know, that seems like a rather defensive response to me. Perhaps self-reflection is in order. Is the idea that friendship might be transactional too scary a thought to consider head on? Here's some science on the topic that is food for thought: https://www.thecut.com/2016/05/half-of-your-friends-probably-dont-think-of-you-as-a-friend.html https://www.thecut.com/2016/05/half-of-your-friends-probably...
- closewith 1y ago
  > Is the idea that friendship might be transactional too scary a thought to consider head on? Rather than be defensive, it was designed to shock you out of your current thought patterns on friendship, because they are almost delusional. Neither movie idealised friends nor real-life friendships have any of the characteristics you describe, and that is distorting your view of the world. Pretending real friendship is a Hollywood myth is self-selecting yourself out of one of the most rewarding aspects of life. Don't do it to yourself. > The study authors gave a survey to 84 college students in the same class, Come on, time to get offline and go make some friends.
  - zug_zug 1y ago
    > Come on, time to get offline and go make some friends. Oof, I really struck a nerve huh? I'm sure you're smart enough to know you shouldn't try to hurt people's feelings just because they believe and idea that you don't believe.
    - closewith 1y ago
      > Oof, I really struck a nerve huh? No, you're misreading the tone here. It's more gentle paternal nudging. Don't let confirmation bias mislead you into a lonely life, especially not based on a study on somecollege students. I know it's more comforting to believe real friendships exist only in fiction rather than admit you haven't experienced it, but in the long run, this belief only hurts you.

subpixel 1y ago

I don’t disagree but I do have a friendship that matches your theoretical definition and I appreciate how rare a thing it is.

Braxton1980 1y ago

>The relationship may or may not even be mutually healthy My best friend of 30 years now met me because I distributed warez in Junior High. He hung around because I had something useful and wanted to maintain a relationship with me. This grew into something more meaningful

msephton 1y ago

I have friends like the first set of criteria, and there's nothing Hollywood about them or me.

watwut 1y ago

I wonder whether you actually watch movies and modern series, because the ones I have seen dont have friendships like you describe in them. Friendships in movies are neither effortless nor healthy. They have conflicts and personality issues to create drama and comedy. Like, I don't know what it is that you watch in TV ... but what I watch is much different.