7 ms·

Quite off topic, but well worth reading nonetheless. So often we live out lives with the subconscious belief that we'll be happy when ...[insert big goal]. Th

by wmboy 14y ago

Quite off topic, but well worth reading nonetheless. So often we live out lives with the subconscious belief that we'll be happy when ...[insert big goal]. The reality is though, if we can't learn to be happy with our imperfect lives as they are today, we'll never be happy.

CodeMage 14y ago
"Happy" is such an ambiguous word and happiness such an elusive concept. While I truly sympathize with the author, this article, like many others in similar vein, seems to offer the same kind of message as that stereotypical mom-to-spoiled-kid admonition: "Eat your food, don't you know how lucky you are? There are children starving in Africa!" I agree that the media are trying to sell us the idea that happiness is a state to be obtained by achieving whatever is the latest definition of "success" and I agree that this is bad. But if we're trying to avoid that, let's be careful not to run into the other extreme: confusing happiness with contentment. It is normal and natural for human beings to want more and strive for it. I think that the idea of "having enough" goes against our nature. Sure, I probably have more than I absolutely need for survival. Sure, I guess I "have enough" according to some arbitrary definition of "having enough". I most definitely "have enough" when you look at it from the point of view of someone who has less. The point I took away from the article is that we should enjoy what good we have. That's a message I can agree with: even if you want more, don't forget to enjoy what you have now. But I can't take that one more step and settle down and say "That's enough." I still don't see why I should do that. Perhaps it'll come to me some day, but for now, all I can think of when people offer me that idea is this passage from Frank Herbert's "Children of Dune": "[...] Tell me, Namri, are you content?" "No." The words came out flat, spontaneous rejection. "Then do you blaspheme?" "Of course not!" "But you aren't contented. You see, Gourney? Namri proves it to us. Every question, every problem doesn't have a single correct answer. [...]"
- vacri 14y ago
  I think that the idea of "having enough" goes against our nature. Our nature as humans or our nature as European-derived societies? Plenty of indigenous peoples around the world are/were quite happy with "having enough". Striving for more is a cultural thing, not 'human nature'.
  - daeken 14y ago
    Our purpose in life is to spread our genes as far and wide as possible. As such, it's not far off to say that "striving for more" is a facet of human nature; having more money, a fancier car, more goats, bigger muscles, etc is a great way to get more mates, and fulfill your evolutionary goals to a larger extent.
    - colmvp 14y ago
      "...having more money, a fancier car, more goats, bigger muscles, etc is a great way to get more mates, and fulfill your evolutionary goals to a larger extent." Indeed. Being rich and famous is a way to compensate for the lack of genetic traits that are typically attractive to the opposite sex (be it height, facial looks, or even race). Salman Rushdie, Jay-Z, Tiger Woods...
    - mattgreenrocks 14y ago
      Fuck success, and all the glorification of it. I've been a slave to it (and ambition, which is just success in another guise) for way too long. Why do I say this? Because I'm not fully convinced it was always me choosing success. I was choosing success out of my own broken desire to be accepted socially, as if I had to redeem myself in people's eyes. This was a false reality I'd constructed based upon negative experiences in the past. The winning move was not to become the Ideal Male Seen On Magazines, but instead to grow into my identity. I have nothing to prove, and no one to impress, ideally. I'm not saying success is bad. I just wonder sometimes if someone benefits from all the neurosis and anxiety that the trappings of success lays for people. Capitalism? VCs? Because it seems that many elements of culture are not created with our best interests in mind. Think about it.
      - koningrobot 14y ago
        The winning move was not to become the Ideal Male Seen On Magazines, but instead to grow into my identity. Sounds like you've traded one mythology for another. I doubt there was any "identity" that you pin-pointed, decided you wanted to grow into, and worked toward growing into. Rather, I think that "to grow into my identity" here means "to grow into that which I will grow into", making it self-fulfilling. Evolution gave us pain and suffering; indeed we shouldn't glorify it. But we should also not glorify the way things are as the way things should be. Can we all please deal with our insecurities in some other way than by making up a story saying it's all okay? The world is on fire. All is not okay.
ibejoeb 14y ago
Are you referring to the article? It's not off-topic if it's worth reading. I'm sure many here are rather well-off but still struggle with happiness.
- wmboy 14y ago
  Well, I'd already read (and enjoyed) this article outside of Hacker News, so when I saw it on the home page I was quite surprised as the article has no reference to technology, start ups or business in general. With that said (& in case I was misunderstood) I have no issue with it being posted!
scottilee 14y ago
Jack Dorsey tweeted this a couple days ago and I thought it was pertinent: "Be happy, but never satisfied." -- Bruce Lee http://twitter.com/jack/status/233963752347795456 http://twitter.com/jack/status/233963752347795456

by wmboy 14y ago

CodeMage 14y ago

"Happy" is such an ambiguous word and happiness such an elusive concept. While I truly sympathize with the author, this article, like many others in similar vein, seems to offer the same kind of message as that stereotypical mom-to-spoiled-kid admonition: "Eat your food, don't you know how lucky you are? There are children starving in Africa!" I agree that the media are trying to sell us the idea that happiness is a state to be obtained by achieving whatever is the latest definition of "success" and I agree that this is bad. But if we're trying to avoid that, let's be careful not to run into the other extreme: confusing happiness with contentment. It is normal and natural for human beings to want more and strive for it. I think that the idea of "having enough" goes against our nature. Sure, I probably have more than I absolutely need for survival. Sure, I guess I "have enough" according to some arbitrary definition of "having enough". I most definitely "have enough" when you look at it from the point of view of someone who has less. The point I took away from the article is that we should enjoy what good we have. That's a message I can agree with: even if you want more, don't forget to enjoy what you have now. But I can't take that one more step and settle down and say "That's enough." I still don't see why I should do that. Perhaps it'll come to me some day, but for now, all I can think of when people offer me that idea is this passage from Frank Herbert's "Children of Dune": "[...] Tell me, Namri, are you content?" "No." The words came out flat, spontaneous rejection. "Then do you blaspheme?" "Of course not!" "But you aren't contented. You see, Gourney? Namri proves it to us. Every question, every problem doesn't have a single correct answer. [...]"

vacri 14y ago
I think that the idea of "having enough" goes against our nature. Our nature as humans or our nature as European-derived societies? Plenty of indigenous peoples around the world are/were quite happy with "having enough". Striving for more is a cultural thing, not 'human nature'.
- daeken 14y ago
  Our purpose in life is to spread our genes as far and wide as possible. As such, it's not far off to say that "striving for more" is a facet of human nature; having more money, a fancier car, more goats, bigger muscles, etc is a great way to get more mates, and fulfill your evolutionary goals to a larger extent.
  - colmvp 14y ago
    "...having more money, a fancier car, more goats, bigger muscles, etc is a great way to get more mates, and fulfill your evolutionary goals to a larger extent." Indeed. Being rich and famous is a way to compensate for the lack of genetic traits that are typically attractive to the opposite sex (be it height, facial looks, or even race). Salman Rushdie, Jay-Z, Tiger Woods...
  - mattgreenrocks 14y ago
    Fuck success, and all the glorification of it. I've been a slave to it (and ambition, which is just success in another guise) for way too long. Why do I say this? Because I'm not fully convinced it was always me choosing success. I was choosing success out of my own broken desire to be accepted socially, as if I had to redeem myself in people's eyes. This was a false reality I'd constructed based upon negative experiences in the past. The winning move was not to become the Ideal Male Seen On Magazines, but instead to grow into my identity. I have nothing to prove, and no one to impress, ideally. I'm not saying success is bad. I just wonder sometimes if someone benefits from all the neurosis and anxiety that the trappings of success lays for people. Capitalism? VCs? Because it seems that many elements of culture are not created with our best interests in mind. Think about it.
    - koningrobot 14y ago
      The winning move was not to become the Ideal Male Seen On Magazines, but instead to grow into my identity. Sounds like you've traded one mythology for another. I doubt there was any "identity" that you pin-pointed, decided you wanted to grow into, and worked toward growing into. Rather, I think that "to grow into my identity" here means "to grow into that which I will grow into", making it self-fulfilling. Evolution gave us pain and suffering; indeed we shouldn't glorify it. But we should also not glorify the way things are as the way things should be. Can we all please deal with our insecurities in some other way than by making up a story saying it's all okay? The world is on fire. All is not okay.

ibejoeb 14y ago

Are you referring to the article? It's not off-topic if it's worth reading. I'm sure many here are rather well-off but still struggle with happiness.

wmboy 14y ago
Well, I'd already read (and enjoyed) this article outside of Hacker News, so when I saw it on the home page I was quite surprised as the article has no reference to technology, start ups or business in general. With that said (& in case I was misunderstood) I have no issue with it being posted!

scottilee 14y ago

Jack Dorsey tweeted this a couple days ago and I thought it was pertinent: "Be happy, but never satisfied." -- Bruce Lee http://twitter.com/jack/status/233963752347795456 http://twitter.com/jack/status/233963752347795456