3 ms·

You can't copyright a font.

by charcircuit 2y ago

datadrivenangel 2y ago
They absolutely are copyrighted and big money.
- EvanAnderson 2y ago
  In the US you can't copyright the shape of a font. You can copyright the programmatic description of a font. Design patents have been awarded for fonts. Trademark and trade dress protections could apply to the specific use of a font but not the font itself. The name of a font itself can be protected by trademark, as well. It's kind of a fascinating topic: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protection_of_typefaces https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protecti... Edit: Back in the mid-90s versions of Corel Draw came with a Truetype editor. A friend of mine made "knock off" versions of fonts they liked from magazines, etc, and made them freely available on his ISP-provided web space. They drew them by hand, using printed samples as the inspiration. Over the years they got some angry messages from a few "type people" who didn't like that they'd made freely available knock-offs of various fonts. (I remember that "Keedy Sans" is one they knocked-off and got a particularly angry email about.) Further aside: My fiend made a sans serif typeface that has a distinct pattern of "erosion" at the edges and voids within the letters. It's easy to tell when it's the font he made. For the last 30 years I've kept samples of the various places I've seen it used, both on the Internet and on physical articles. I find it so amazing that a TTF file made by a kid in Corel Draw in 1994 or 1995 ended up being used in advertisements, on packaging, etc.
  - knuckleheadsmif 2y ago
    But you can Copyright the Name of a font. But yes long standing rule says you can copyright how letters & numbers look. Note that if you make a font that contains your own “artwork’ that does not represent a letter or number you can get protection for that. And only fairly recently (in the past 30 years—I forget when Adobe won this court case) the courts ruled you can protect the code for generating a fonts look from being copied.
    - Aloisius 2y ago
      You can't copyright the name of a font in the US. You can trademark it.
  - weinzierl 2y ago
    In the 90s Corel Draw came with a Helvetica named Swiss. Microsoft wasn't as bold and called theirs Arial.
    - floriankarsten 2y ago
      [dead]
    - glacier5674 2y ago
      [dead]
    - Gormo 2y ago
      Corel's "Swiss" font is identical to Helvetica. Arial has many differences.
  - devmor 2y ago
    > In the US you can't copyright the shape of a font. You can copyright the programmatic description of a font. The organization in question is a UK organization, and you can in fact copyright a font in the UK. The US is unrelated to this issue.
- colechristensen 2y ago
  You can, entirely legally, make a copy of any font and distribute it freely. You can't copy the font files themselves, but you can make visually indistinguishable new fonts with the same shapes because the shapes are not protected by copyright. Additionally though, some fonts have design patents, which does protect the shape. Unlike copyright which has absolutely crazy expiration (like 150 years occasionally?) these patents only cover 15 to 20 years or shorter if abandoned. An example of Apple patenting a font valid 2017 to 2032: https://patents.google.com/patent/USD786338S1/en https://patents.google.com/patent/USD786338S1/en
  - raincole 2y ago
    So if I already have the file (legally acquired or not), I'm free to use it for print? Cause obviously distributing T-shirts isn't distributing font files?
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - Gormo 2y ago
      In the US, yes.
    - colechristensen 2y ago
      It depends on if it has a design patent on it or not.
WillAdams 2y ago
A typeface design, in the U.S., no, but the digital font file comprising outline data and instructions, according to current U.S. law, for an overview of current case law and a proposal see: https://digitalcommons.law.scu.edu/chtlj/vol10/iss1/5/ https://digitalcommons.law.scu.edu/chtlj/vol10/iss1/5/
- crazygringo 2y ago
  There's no evidence XBAND Rough was extracted from a digital source bit-for-bit, unless someone can point to any? It seems like it was just a hobbyist project to recreate the look of the font from the anti-piracy ads? Which is 100% legal. Edit: OK, so the original font appears to be "FF Confidential"? Why didn't the post even mention that? So maybe it is a digital clone, which would be illegal. But then strange that there aren't any DMCA takedowns of it on major font sites?
  - selkin 2y ago
    XBAND Rough could not have been inspired by those ads, as the OP shows the ads are using XBAND, and not FF Confidential, the original tyepface it cloned.
    - s4i 2y ago
      We don’t know what the ads (meaning, the videos) used. We only know what was on their website.
  - sct202 2y ago
    Idk if it's provable how it was recreated but if you type in "XBAND Rough" into the sampler box at the bottom of the page https://www.myfonts.com/collections/ff-confidential-font-fontfont https://www.myfonts.com/collections/ff-confidential-font-fon... and compare to https://fontzone.net/font-details/xband-rough https://fontzone.net/font-details/xband-rough it's exactly the same and the letter splotching is very distinct in the lower case letters.
    - 2y ago
taneliv 2y ago
Maybe not in the US, but fonts do enjoy copyright protection in at least some European markets.[1] I frequently encountered this campaign on DVDs for rent in the local Blockbuster equivalents, so I don't think it is entirely theoretical infringement, either. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protection_of_typefaces#Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protecti... and forward
NikkiA 2y ago
FACT/FAST are a UK organisation, where font copyright is espressly enumerated in the copyright law.
andirk 2y ago
"You wouldn't copyright a font"
xyst 2y ago
You can copyright just about anything as long as you have the _money_ T-Mobile trademarked a very specific pink, "Magenta" There’s even a company that holds trademarks on a set of colors, Pantone. Courts have yet to reverse or revoke these silly trademarks.
- usefulcat 2y ago
  Trademark and copyright are not the same thing..
- dredmorbius 2y ago
  Trademark != copyright.
- lotsofpulp 2y ago
  T-Mobile does not have a trademark on the color magenta, nor does Pantone on any colors. The trademark is for using that color to market your product such that a buyer might assume they are buying T-mobile, but in reality they are not. Or for Pantone, that a buyer is buying a color quality controlled by Pantone.

You can't copyright a font.

datadrivenangel 2y ago

They absolutely are copyrighted and big money.

EvanAnderson 2y ago
In the US you can't copyright the shape of a font. You can copyright the programmatic description of a font. Design patents have been awarded for fonts. Trademark and trade dress protections could apply to the specific use of a font but not the font itself. The name of a font itself can be protected by trademark, as well. It's kind of a fascinating topic: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protection_of_typefaces https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protecti... Edit: Back in the mid-90s versions of Corel Draw came with a Truetype editor. A friend of mine made "knock off" versions of fonts they liked from magazines, etc, and made them freely available on his ISP-provided web space. They drew them by hand, using printed samples as the inspiration. Over the years they got some angry messages from a few "type people" who didn't like that they'd made freely available knock-offs of various fonts. (I remember that "Keedy Sans" is one they knocked-off and got a particularly angry email about.) Further aside: My fiend made a sans serif typeface that has a distinct pattern of "erosion" at the edges and voids within the letters. It's easy to tell when it's the font he made. For the last 30 years I've kept samples of the various places I've seen it used, both on the Internet and on physical articles. I find it so amazing that a TTF file made by a kid in Corel Draw in 1994 or 1995 ended up being used in advertisements, on packaging, etc.
- knuckleheadsmif 2y ago
  But you can Copyright the Name of a font. But yes long standing rule says you can copyright how letters & numbers look. Note that if you make a font that contains your own “artwork’ that does not represent a letter or number you can get protection for that. And only fairly recently (in the past 30 years—I forget when Adobe won this court case) the courts ruled you can protect the code for generating a fonts look from being copied.
  - Aloisius 2y ago
    You can't copyright the name of a font in the US. You can trademark it.
- weinzierl 2y ago
  In the 90s Corel Draw came with a Helvetica named Swiss. Microsoft wasn't as bold and called theirs Arial.
  - floriankarsten 2y ago
    [dead]
  - glacier5674 2y ago
    [dead]
  - Gormo 2y ago
    Corel's "Swiss" font is identical to Helvetica. Arial has many differences.
- devmor 2y ago
  > In the US you can't copyright the shape of a font. You can copyright the programmatic description of a font. The organization in question is a UK organization, and you can in fact copyright a font in the UK. The US is unrelated to this issue.
colechristensen 2y ago
You can, entirely legally, make a copy of any font and distribute it freely. You can't copy the font files themselves, but you can make visually indistinguishable new fonts with the same shapes because the shapes are not protected by copyright. Additionally though, some fonts have design patents, which does protect the shape. Unlike copyright which has absolutely crazy expiration (like 150 years occasionally?) these patents only cover 15 to 20 years or shorter if abandoned. An example of Apple patenting a font valid 2017 to 2032: https://patents.google.com/patent/USD786338S1/en https://patents.google.com/patent/USD786338S1/en
- raincole 2y ago
  So if I already have the file (legally acquired or not), I'm free to use it for print? Cause obviously distributing T-shirts isn't distributing font files?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - Gormo 2y ago
    In the US, yes.
  - colechristensen 2y ago
    It depends on if it has a design patent on it or not.

WillAdams 2y ago

A typeface design, in the U.S., no, but the digital font file comprising outline data and instructions, according to current U.S. law, for an overview of current case law and a proposal see: https://digitalcommons.law.scu.edu/chtlj/vol10/iss1/5/ https://digitalcommons.law.scu.edu/chtlj/vol10/iss1/5/

crazygringo 2y ago
There's no evidence XBAND Rough was extracted from a digital source bit-for-bit, unless someone can point to any? It seems like it was just a hobbyist project to recreate the look of the font from the anti-piracy ads? Which is 100% legal. Edit: OK, so the original font appears to be "FF Confidential"? Why didn't the post even mention that? So maybe it is a digital clone, which would be illegal. But then strange that there aren't any DMCA takedowns of it on major font sites?
- selkin 2y ago
  XBAND Rough could not have been inspired by those ads, as the OP shows the ads are using XBAND, and not FF Confidential, the original tyepface it cloned.
  - s4i 2y ago
    We don’t know what the ads (meaning, the videos) used. We only know what was on their website.
- sct202 2y ago
  Idk if it's provable how it was recreated but if you type in "XBAND Rough" into the sampler box at the bottom of the page https://www.myfonts.com/collections/ff-confidential-font-fontfont https://www.myfonts.com/collections/ff-confidential-font-fon... and compare to https://fontzone.net/font-details/xband-rough https://fontzone.net/font-details/xband-rough it's exactly the same and the letter splotching is very distinct in the lower case letters.
  - 2y ago

taneliv 2y ago

Maybe not in the US, but fonts do enjoy copyright protection in at least some European markets.[1] I frequently encountered this campaign on DVDs for rent in the local Blockbuster equivalents, so I don't think it is entirely theoretical infringement, either. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protection_of_typefaces#Germany https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intellectual_property_protecti... and forward

NikkiA 2y ago

FACT/FAST are a UK organisation, where font copyright is espressly enumerated in the copyright law.

andirk 2y ago

"You wouldn't copyright a font"

xyst 2y ago

You can copyright just about anything as long as you have the _money_ T-Mobile trademarked a very specific pink, "Magenta" There’s even a company that holds trademarks on a set of colors, Pantone. Courts have yet to reverse or revoke these silly trademarks.

usefulcat 2y ago
Trademark and copyright are not the same thing..
dredmorbius 2y ago
Trademark != copyright.
lotsofpulp 2y ago
T-Mobile does not have a trademark on the color magenta, nor does Pantone on any colors. The trademark is for using that color to market your product such that a buyer might assume they are buying T-mobile, but in reality they are not. Or for Pantone, that a buyer is buying a color quality controlled by Pantone.