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Why do college students have to continue to pay back their loans when the legislature is bipartisanly comfortable writing off $50k+ PPP day loans per business f

Why do college students have to continue to pay back their loans when the legislature is bipartisanly comfortable writing off $50k+ PPP day loans per business from Covid Pandemic? [0] [0] https://pppreport.org/ https://pppreport.org/

Y_Y 2y ago
It may also be a factor that the student loans cannot be discharged through bankruptcy. The government may be afraid of (even scammy) businesses shutting down, but there's no danger with student-debtors.
Joker_vD 2y ago
Because the legislature is not bipartisanly comfortable with writing off the student loans. Duh.
monocularvision 2y ago
Because that program was designed from the beginning to be forgiven. It was about keeping businesses afloat during extraordinary times and keep paychecks going to folks. People who compare student loan forgiveness to PPP are not making a good faith argument.
- Volundr 2y ago
  It certainly wasn't sold to the public as "these are going to be forgiven". After all they are called loans not grants. And given all the retoric around "it's simple you took out a loan, now you pay it back" or "why should my tax dollars pay for your loan forgiveness" I think it's very fair to why this logic applies to people not businesses.
  - monocularvision 2y ago
    It was literally in the bill when it passed! What are you talking about? I very distinctly remember this being promoted as part of the package. The deal was “if a business spends a percentage this money on payroll, it will be forgive”. It was designed to keep businesses afloat for a set amount of time as we locked down for COVID.
  - Aloisius 2y ago
    It's in all the news articles from the time. The loans were forgivable if they used them for payroll and didn't fire anyone for a certain period. https://www.npr.org/2020/03/26/821457551/whats-inside-the-senate-s-2-trillion-coronavirus-aid-package https://www.npr.org/2020/03/26/821457551/whats-inside-the-se... https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/business/coronavirus-stimulus-small-business.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/business/coronavirus-stim... https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/small-businesses-face-nightmare-cash-crunch-coronavirus-pandemic/story?id=69779601 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/small-businesses-face-nightm...
  - 9283409232 2y ago
    They were sold to the public as "if you don't fire people during the pandemic, they will be forgiven"
- xracy 2y ago
  Sorry, wouldn't student loans be about keeping businesses afloat during extraordinary times? Otherwise they risk losing a workforce that otherwise would've come out of college during the pandemic? That's a good to society as well. Arguably one with likely better payoff given that a lot more college graduates succeed in getting a degree than businesses succeeded in paying their PPP loans.
- bdangubic 2y ago
  that would be like 0.765% of PPP loans… (I got two of them as self-employed running as S-Corp, certainly did not need either and didn’t even want to apply until I realized that Los Angeles Lakers have…)
- righthand 2y ago
  Most of the money wasn’t used for business expenses or payroll. That’s why it even ended up in the forgiveness bin. It was so unregulated that it was a joke that anyone used it for what the program was intended for.
ecshafer 2y ago
Members of congress as a class took a lot of said ppp loans foe their “businesses”. They dont have a lot of student loans debt.
tboyd47 2y ago
The straightforward, blunt answer is that the financial economy depends on having a class of high-earning people who are on the hook for paying a lot of interest and unable to get out of it.
kylette 2y ago
[flagged]
hayst4ck 2y ago
There are two fundamental belief systems about truth. One is based on reason, where people look for contradictions (like you're doing right now) in order to better understand truth. The other is based on authority or faith, where people look to authority figures, such as parents, priests, pundits, or politicians, in order to understand "truth". These are incompatible. You can't point out contradictions to an authority oriented person and expect them to care. While you are using your words, they have already made off with the money. Your reason got you nowhere, while their power got them $50k+ loans. They could do what they did with action while you are soothing yourself with words. One thing authority oriented people understand is that actions matter most and that the highest truth is found within action on the physical world.
- xracy 2y ago
  This is honestly insightful to me in a way that I struggle to relate to one of my family members because I try and make appeals to logic and the truth, and they make a ton of appeals to people they think I would find to be authority figures. I have never seen this stated in such a clean way that got me to that understanding. I guess it doesn't help me solve it, but baby steps.
- e40 2y ago
  I think there is a third dimension to this: identity. What Trump has done is make his followers feel they are the brand. They are MAGA. That means it doesn't matter what system of truth you adhere to, because you will always go with your identity, which is MAGA. Yes, this is exactly how cults work.
  - hayst4ck 2y ago
    Pedantically, it would be a second dimension, but I don't think that it is orthogonal, I think it's an aberration of the result of "truth as authority." As the authority figure deviates further and further from reality, it makes them increasingly hostile to those who reason, but it also creates a cost to acknowledging reality. The cultists would have to acknowledge they were suckered or otherwise deficient. All those contradictions that were ignored protect their alternative reality because they represent pain that must be overcome. Without being willing to face the pain of being wrong and all those you have harmed through being wrong, you must stay in your alternative reality.
chneu 2y ago
America loves corporate welfare while hating on individual welfare. If a business fails we have no problem bailing them out. It isn't the businesses fault. It's the current economic situation. If an individual fails then they made mistakes and failed to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. I'm being a bit hyperbolic but really, America loves corporate welfare. Look at the south: they'll sell themselves down the river for 20 oil refinery jobs but the second someone needs food stamps they're a loser. A lil bit of it is also the "not yet a millionaire" mentality that a lot of Americans have. They believe that one day they'll also be rich so we shouldn't punish the rich, it may be them one day.
- Eddy_Viscosity2 2y ago
  > America loves corporate welfare while hating on individual welfare. More the case that America is run (directly or indirectly) by the ultra-rich and they designed a system that works for them and sucks for everyone else.

Y_Y 2y ago

It may also be a factor that the student loans cannot be discharged through bankruptcy. The government may be afraid of (even scammy) businesses shutting down, but there's no danger with student-debtors.

Joker_vD 2y ago

Because the legislature is not bipartisanly comfortable with writing off the student loans. Duh.

monocularvision 2y ago

Because that program was designed from the beginning to be forgiven. It was about keeping businesses afloat during extraordinary times and keep paychecks going to folks. People who compare student loan forgiveness to PPP are not making a good faith argument.

Volundr 2y ago
It certainly wasn't sold to the public as "these are going to be forgiven". After all they are called loans not grants. And given all the retoric around "it's simple you took out a loan, now you pay it back" or "why should my tax dollars pay for your loan forgiveness" I think it's very fair to why this logic applies to people not businesses.
- monocularvision 2y ago
  It was literally in the bill when it passed! What are you talking about? I very distinctly remember this being promoted as part of the package. The deal was “if a business spends a percentage this money on payroll, it will be forgive”. It was designed to keep businesses afloat for a set amount of time as we locked down for COVID.
- Aloisius 2y ago
  It's in all the news articles from the time. The loans were forgivable if they used them for payroll and didn't fire anyone for a certain period. https://www.npr.org/2020/03/26/821457551/whats-inside-the-senate-s-2-trillion-coronavirus-aid-package https://www.npr.org/2020/03/26/821457551/whats-inside-the-se... https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/business/coronavirus-stimulus-small-business.html https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/business/coronavirus-stim... https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/small-businesses-face-nightmare-cash-crunch-coronavirus-pandemic/story?id=69779601 https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/small-businesses-face-nightm...
- 9283409232 2y ago
  They were sold to the public as "if you don't fire people during the pandemic, they will be forgiven"
xracy 2y ago
Sorry, wouldn't student loans be about keeping businesses afloat during extraordinary times? Otherwise they risk losing a workforce that otherwise would've come out of college during the pandemic? That's a good to society as well. Arguably one with likely better payoff given that a lot more college graduates succeed in getting a degree than businesses succeeded in paying their PPP loans.
bdangubic 2y ago
that would be like 0.765% of PPP loans… (I got two of them as self-employed running as S-Corp, certainly did not need either and didn’t even want to apply until I realized that Los Angeles Lakers have…)
righthand 2y ago
Most of the money wasn’t used for business expenses or payroll. That’s why it even ended up in the forgiveness bin. It was so unregulated that it was a joke that anyone used it for what the program was intended for.

ecshafer 2y ago

Members of congress as a class took a lot of said ppp loans foe their “businesses”. They dont have a lot of student loans debt.

tboyd47 2y ago

The straightforward, blunt answer is that the financial economy depends on having a class of high-earning people who are on the hook for paying a lot of interest and unable to get out of it.

kylette 2y ago

[flagged]

hayst4ck 2y ago

There are two fundamental belief systems about truth. One is based on reason, where people look for contradictions (like you're doing right now) in order to better understand truth. The other is based on authority or faith, where people look to authority figures, such as parents, priests, pundits, or politicians, in order to understand "truth". These are incompatible. You can't point out contradictions to an authority oriented person and expect them to care. While you are using your words, they have already made off with the money. Your reason got you nowhere, while their power got them $50k+ loans. They could do what they did with action while you are soothing yourself with words. One thing authority oriented people understand is that actions matter most and that the highest truth is found within action on the physical world.

xracy 2y ago
This is honestly insightful to me in a way that I struggle to relate to one of my family members because I try and make appeals to logic and the truth, and they make a ton of appeals to people they think I would find to be authority figures. I have never seen this stated in such a clean way that got me to that understanding. I guess it doesn't help me solve it, but baby steps.
e40 2y ago
I think there is a third dimension to this: identity. What Trump has done is make his followers feel they are the brand. They are MAGA. That means it doesn't matter what system of truth you adhere to, because you will always go with your identity, which is MAGA. Yes, this is exactly how cults work.
- hayst4ck 2y ago
  Pedantically, it would be a second dimension, but I don't think that it is orthogonal, I think it's an aberration of the result of "truth as authority." As the authority figure deviates further and further from reality, it makes them increasingly hostile to those who reason, but it also creates a cost to acknowledging reality. The cultists would have to acknowledge they were suckered or otherwise deficient. All those contradictions that were ignored protect their alternative reality because they represent pain that must be overcome. Without being willing to face the pain of being wrong and all those you have harmed through being wrong, you must stay in your alternative reality.

chneu 2y ago

America loves corporate welfare while hating on individual welfare. If a business fails we have no problem bailing them out. It isn't the businesses fault. It's the current economic situation. If an individual fails then they made mistakes and failed to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. I'm being a bit hyperbolic but really, America loves corporate welfare. Look at the south: they'll sell themselves down the river for 20 oil refinery jobs but the second someone needs food stamps they're a loser. A lil bit of it is also the "not yet a millionaire" mentality that a lot of Americans have. They believe that one day they'll also be rich so we shouldn't punish the rich, it may be them one day.

Eddy_Viscosity2 2y ago
> America loves corporate welfare while hating on individual welfare. More the case that America is run (directly or indirectly) by the ultra-rich and they designed a system that works for them and sucks for everyone else.