4 ms·

Oh man, didn't the president just re-activate coal mining? What are they going to do with all that coal? Asia might of wanted it before the trade war, but not a

Oh man, didn't the president just re-activate coal mining? What are they going to do with all that coal? Asia might of wanted it before the trade war, but not anymore? Oh. I guess we can feed it into the AI data center generators.

r00fus 2y ago
Trump can say what he wants, but the market has moved on from coal.
- chrisco255 2y ago
  Except in India and China: https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/fossil-fuels/china-and-india-are-building-coal-generating-capacity-for-energy-security/ https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/fossil-fuels/chin...
  - porphyra 2y ago
    At least the percentage of renewable energy generation in China is steadily increasing. It has gone from 17% back in 2008 to 32% in 2024. And solar and wind are growing at a rapid pace. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renewable_energy_in_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renewable_energy_in_China
  - bamboozled 2y ago
    Both countries are smart enough to know that being reliant on foreign oil and coal for everything is stupid, they are moving away to solar and wind, not just for security reasons but also because they produce most of the panels already so they supply their own demand then use the extra capacity to profit via exports. It's done.
bamboozled 2y ago
If you go look at the price of some of the mid-high end Chinese panels, you could pay 200% in tariff costs and still be getting a bargain. Check out LONGi for example. I'll be ordering a bunch of these for a renovation I'm doing this year and I'll be installing quite lot of capacity, it's a no brainier to go solar, especially considering the price of energy now days. Maybe people doing this will be labeled radical, extremists or activists for installing panels on their roof soon but I don't care, it's my roof.
- ein0p 2y ago
  Note also that tariff is paid on the _import price_, which is a fraction of retail. Many people do not understand this.
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    This is why Chinese social media is communicating to consumers to buy direct and cutout the developed world middle man. https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/chinese-manufacturer-tiktok-luxury-tariffs-viral-1235321071/ https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/chines... | https://archive.today/rVvix https://archive.today/rVvix https://x.com/abby4thepeople/status/1911238808018014587 https://x.com/abby4thepeople/status/1911238808018014587 | https://archive.today/dwyw7 https://archive.today/dwyw7
  - bamboozled 2y ago
    That depends on what the retail markup is on any item? I don't think it really matters because if I buy $2000 worth of panels directly, I'm still getting hit with ~ $800 of tariffs. You point out an interesting point here though, this plan will backfire even harder for the USA in my opinion because it sounds like American middlemen are now absolutely screwed. We will all just be buying from China directly and boosting their online retail capability.
    - ein0p 2y ago
      The implication being that those panels aren't really $2K when they cross the border. They're more like $500, at most. And that's what the tariff gets applied to. People think 100% tariff means the price doubles. But it shouldn't, especially on the various tchotchkes which are bought for a buck and sold in the US for $5. Note that "shouldn't" ≠ "won't". Greed is a thing.
      - bamboozled 2y ago
        You're still paying the tariff...nothing negates the fact that you're now paying $800 extra for the panels for no reason at all. I'm already buying direct anyway...I don't see why you're bringing greed into it. It sounds like you might be trying to help people feel positive about paying more in taxes? I can still pay the tariff and get great panels at an affordable price anyway...

r00fus 2y ago

Trump can say what he wants, but the market has moved on from coal.

chrisco255 2y ago
Except in India and China: https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/fossil-fuels/china-and-india-are-building-coal-generating-capacity-for-energy-security/ https://www.instituteforenergyresearch.org/fossil-fuels/chin...
- porphyra 2y ago
  At least the percentage of renewable energy generation in China is steadily increasing. It has gone from 17% back in 2008 to 32% in 2024. And solar and wind are growing at a rapid pace. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renewable_energy_in_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renewable_energy_in_China
- bamboozled 2y ago
  Both countries are smart enough to know that being reliant on foreign oil and coal for everything is stupid, they are moving away to solar and wind, not just for security reasons but also because they produce most of the panels already so they supply their own demand then use the extra capacity to profit via exports. It's done.

bamboozled 2y ago

If you go look at the price of some of the mid-high end Chinese panels, you could pay 200% in tariff costs and still be getting a bargain. Check out LONGi for example. I'll be ordering a bunch of these for a renovation I'm doing this year and I'll be installing quite lot of capacity, it's a no brainier to go solar, especially considering the price of energy now days. Maybe people doing this will be labeled radical, extremists or activists for installing panels on their roof soon but I don't care, it's my roof.

ein0p 2y ago
Note also that tariff is paid on the _import price_, which is a fraction of retail. Many people do not understand this.
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  This is why Chinese social media is communicating to consumers to buy direct and cutout the developed world middle man. https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/chinese-manufacturer-tiktok-luxury-tariffs-viral-1235321071/ https://www.rollingstone.com/culture/culture-features/chines... | https://archive.today/rVvix https://archive.today/rVvix https://x.com/abby4thepeople/status/1911238808018014587 https://x.com/abby4thepeople/status/1911238808018014587 | https://archive.today/dwyw7 https://archive.today/dwyw7
- bamboozled 2y ago
  That depends on what the retail markup is on any item? I don't think it really matters because if I buy $2000 worth of panels directly, I'm still getting hit with ~ $800 of tariffs. You point out an interesting point here though, this plan will backfire even harder for the USA in my opinion because it sounds like American middlemen are now absolutely screwed. We will all just be buying from China directly and boosting their online retail capability.
  - ein0p 2y ago
    The implication being that those panels aren't really $2K when they cross the border. They're more like $500, at most. And that's what the tariff gets applied to. People think 100% tariff means the price doubles. But it shouldn't, especially on the various tchotchkes which are bought for a buck and sold in the US for $5. Note that "shouldn't" ≠ "won't". Greed is a thing.
    - bamboozled 2y ago
      You're still paying the tariff...nothing negates the fact that you're now paying $800 extra for the panels for no reason at all. I'm already buying direct anyway...I don't see why you're bringing greed into it. It sounds like you might be trying to help people feel positive about paying more in taxes? I can still pay the tariff and get great panels at an affordable price anyway...