4 ms·

> But to my knowledge, no savage kid is in need of being forced to learn it Uhh then your knowledge is very limited because that is rather well documented. Als

> But to my knowledge, no savage kid is in need of being forced to learn it Uhh then your knowledge is very limited because that is rather well documented. Also, why are you saying "savage" like an 18th century racist? Is that in fashion again?

lukan 1y ago
Oh, I am obviously a racist, by glorifying indigineous teaching methods. But otherwise can you show, where this is documented? The natives tribes where I have some knowledge, don't force their kids to learn in the sense that is talked about here. No need to - the whole culture is about becoming a good hunter (for male individuals). So indeed lots of peer pressure, but no individual forcing.
- margalabargala 1y ago
  > Oh, I am obviously a racist, by glorifying indigineous teaching methods. No, by calling people "savages", a pejorative, based on their ethnicity. Much like how it would be racist to call people "enslavers" based on their ethnicity, or "cotton pickers" based on their ethnicity.
  - lukan 1y ago
    Erm, english is not my first language, but I believe, savage stands for uncivilised person. So exactly what I wanted to talk about, when referencing "natural education". I did not talk about any ethnicity at all.
    - guerrilla 1y ago
      It's considered super racist but also awkwardly old fashioned anyway even if it weren't just the former.
      - lukan 1y ago
        Ok, seriously. I did not talk about any ethnicity at all. How exactly can I made a racist statement here? Or were you simply trying to say, for you the term "savage" is strongly connected to racists and therefore inappropriate to use?
        guerrilla 1y ago
        Calling indigenous people "savage" in English is almost universally considered racist.
        lukan 1y ago
        Well, or just in your bubble? Besides, I called arbitary savage people savage. No concrete person that might feel insulted. And savage .. is not an insult in my bubble anyway btw.
        guerrilla 1y ago
        Like you said, you're not a native English speaker.
    - margalabargala 1y ago
      Talking about a specific ethnicity is not required to be racist in English. If a person were to use the word "Nazi" to describe any person who lives in an area that was Nazi-controlled in 1942, this would be roughly equivalent in terms of the connotation and in terms of the reasonable indignation the recipient might feel. Furthermore, if you didn't have a specific ethnicity in mind, then when you're going off about "natural education", what you're really saying here is "all groups of people that are part of a group I consider 'uncivilized' are the same". Or alternately, if ethnicity isn't what you're using as your basis for calling groups of people and their children "uncivilized", what is?
      - lukan 1y ago
        "Or alternately, if ethnicity isn't what you're using as your basis for calling groups of people and their children "uncivilized", what is?" Culture. And this debate is equally fascinating and frustrating. I simply spoke of generic nomadic uncivilised hunters. And not at all in a bad way, just to illustrate a point. Because to my knowledge yes, nomadic hunting cultures do have similarities. Education seems to be one of those. Feel free to provide counter examples.
scandox 1y ago
[flagged]

lukan 1y ago

Oh, I am obviously a racist, by glorifying indigineous teaching methods. But otherwise can you show, where this is documented? The natives tribes where I have some knowledge, don't force their kids to learn in the sense that is talked about here. No need to - the whole culture is about becoming a good hunter (for male individuals). So indeed lots of peer pressure, but no individual forcing.

margalabargala 1y ago
> Oh, I am obviously a racist, by glorifying indigineous teaching methods. No, by calling people "savages", a pejorative, based on their ethnicity. Much like how it would be racist to call people "enslavers" based on their ethnicity, or "cotton pickers" based on their ethnicity.
- lukan 1y ago
  Erm, english is not my first language, but I believe, savage stands for uncivilised person. So exactly what I wanted to talk about, when referencing "natural education". I did not talk about any ethnicity at all.
  - guerrilla 1y ago
    It's considered super racist but also awkwardly old fashioned anyway even if it weren't just the former.
    - lukan 1y ago
      Ok, seriously. I did not talk about any ethnicity at all. How exactly can I made a racist statement here? Or were you simply trying to say, for you the term "savage" is strongly connected to racists and therefore inappropriate to use?
      - guerrilla 1y ago
        Calling indigenous people "savage" in English is almost universally considered racist.
        lukan 1y ago
        Well, or just in your bubble? Besides, I called arbitary savage people savage. No concrete person that might feel insulted. And savage .. is not an insult in my bubble anyway btw.
        guerrilla 1y ago
        Like you said, you're not a native English speaker.
  - margalabargala 1y ago
    Talking about a specific ethnicity is not required to be racist in English. If a person were to use the word "Nazi" to describe any person who lives in an area that was Nazi-controlled in 1942, this would be roughly equivalent in terms of the connotation and in terms of the reasonable indignation the recipient might feel. Furthermore, if you didn't have a specific ethnicity in mind, then when you're going off about "natural education", what you're really saying here is "all groups of people that are part of a group I consider 'uncivilized' are the same". Or alternately, if ethnicity isn't what you're using as your basis for calling groups of people and their children "uncivilized", what is?
    - lukan 1y ago
      "Or alternately, if ethnicity isn't what you're using as your basis for calling groups of people and their children "uncivilized", what is?" Culture. And this debate is equally fascinating and frustrating. I simply spoke of generic nomadic uncivilised hunters. And not at all in a bad way, just to illustrate a point. Because to my knowledge yes, nomadic hunting cultures do have similarities. Education seems to be one of those. Feel free to provide counter examples.

scandox 1y ago

[flagged]