4 ms·

Fair enough, elections could really cause political instability. Would you be in favor of a referendum, simply asking Ukrainian people if they want to continue

Fair enough, elections could really cause political instability. Would you be in favor of a referendum, simply asking Ukrainian people if they want to continue fighting or accept peace under whatever conditions are offered by Russia and the US?

hkpack 1y ago
Russia made their conditions very clear multiple times from the start of the war and never changed them a bit. People overwhelmingly continue to answer them every single day.
- ashoeafoot 1y ago
  Russia said it wanted the UN involved so it could veto all the things via the security council. Russia lies and brraks contracts , you can not make deals with a rabid wulf.
  - TylerLives 1y ago
    What's the alternative, fight until the last Ukrainian? And we can't even have a referendum there, to make sure this is what Ukrainian people really want?
    - throwaway290 1y ago
      Once you start torturing somebody to make them do what you want, it is important to pause sometimes and ask if that's what they really want to continue hurting, or are they finally going to do/say what you want now. Every psycho knows that. You have goals, you are a busy man. after all you hate torture, you just have to do it to achieve your goals because some people don't want to bend to you voluntarily for some reason... Of course Ukrainian people don't want it. Who would ever want it? But you're asking the wrong people. Ukrainians don't have a choice. Someone who HAS a choice is one guy who sent troops to start it and since then continuously costs lives on both sides (and now also North Korean and Chinese lives too). He can stop at any time and he's not the one defending his home. So if you are so concerned about Ukrainians your alternative is to make that motherfucker go away forever. Hold a referendum, assassinate him, idk. You have my blessing.
      - TylerLives 1y ago
        >Ukrainians don't have a choice. Why not? What in the life of an average Ukrainian will change if he is ruled by a bureaucrat from Moscow instead of a bureaucrat from Washington? Let's say that he prefers a bureaucrat from Washington. Does he prefer him so much that he's willing to die for this? In an ideal world Ukrainian people would have sovereignty, but this is not the world we live in. By refusing to accept this, we're pushing them to commit national suicide.
        throwaway290 1y ago
        > What in the life of an average Ukrainian will change if he is ruled by a bureaucrat from Moscow instead of a bureaucrat from Washington "ruled by" shows you are a russian troll. A democratic government serves the citizens. You're "ruled by" if you're in a country like russia. Ukrainians had their chosen government. > By refusing to accept this By posing like somebody from the west you are trying to get them to internalize as if they have no choice, but they do have a choice as per my other comment. Putler has a choice every day whether to continue or not, and west has a choice whether to stop him. It's Ukrainians who don't have a choice but to stop him. I don't think I need to engage further, it's pretty obvious and you are not saying anything I haven't heard before.
ashoeafoot 1y ago
same referendum in Russia ?
throwaway290 1y ago
As a Russian I think you should have a referendum in Russia first. Their last real election was longer ago

hkpack 1y ago

Russia made their conditions very clear multiple times from the start of the war and never changed them a bit. People overwhelmingly continue to answer them every single day.

ashoeafoot 1y ago
Russia said it wanted the UN involved so it could veto all the things via the security council. Russia lies and brraks contracts , you can not make deals with a rabid wulf.
- TylerLives 1y ago
  What's the alternative, fight until the last Ukrainian? And we can't even have a referendum there, to make sure this is what Ukrainian people really want?
  - throwaway290 1y ago
    Once you start torturing somebody to make them do what you want, it is important to pause sometimes and ask if that's what they really want to continue hurting, or are they finally going to do/say what you want now. Every psycho knows that. You have goals, you are a busy man. after all you hate torture, you just have to do it to achieve your goals because some people don't want to bend to you voluntarily for some reason... Of course Ukrainian people don't want it. Who would ever want it? But you're asking the wrong people. Ukrainians don't have a choice. Someone who HAS a choice is one guy who sent troops to start it and since then continuously costs lives on both sides (and now also North Korean and Chinese lives too). He can stop at any time and he's not the one defending his home. So if you are so concerned about Ukrainians your alternative is to make that motherfucker go away forever. Hold a referendum, assassinate him, idk. You have my blessing.
    - TylerLives 1y ago
      >Ukrainians don't have a choice. Why not? What in the life of an average Ukrainian will change if he is ruled by a bureaucrat from Moscow instead of a bureaucrat from Washington? Let's say that he prefers a bureaucrat from Washington. Does he prefer him so much that he's willing to die for this? In an ideal world Ukrainian people would have sovereignty, but this is not the world we live in. By refusing to accept this, we're pushing them to commit national suicide.
      - throwaway290 1y ago
        > What in the life of an average Ukrainian will change if he is ruled by a bureaucrat from Moscow instead of a bureaucrat from Washington "ruled by" shows you are a russian troll. A democratic government serves the citizens. You're "ruled by" if you're in a country like russia. Ukrainians had their chosen government. > By refusing to accept this By posing like somebody from the west you are trying to get them to internalize as if they have no choice, but they do have a choice as per my other comment. Putler has a choice every day whether to continue or not, and west has a choice whether to stop him. It's Ukrainians who don't have a choice but to stop him. I don't think I need to engage further, it's pretty obvious and you are not saying anything I haven't heard before.

ashoeafoot 1y ago

same referendum in Russia ?

throwaway290 1y ago

As a Russian I think you should have a referendum in Russia first. Their last real election was longer ago