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US ready to abandon Ukraine peace deal if there is no progress, says Marco Rubio

13 points by prmph 2y ago

croes 2y ago
What deal if there is no progress? Art of the deal, Final Chapter: How to make a deal with Putin. You can’t.
theGeatZhopa 2y ago
So super stupid to think one is going to be able to talk to Russia and convince them giving up a thing, they started by themselves. If they're progressing, constantly acquire land mass, despite sanctions, less earnings and all the backlash put on Russia by the whole world - we're not talking about the humans died for this on both sides. So how is it called if you play poker with someone who's got nothing to lose and still has big enough pockets. That's a big gamble. There's no deal, if the other don't want to. Putin doesn't want. We need more pressure.
- quantified 2y ago
  Unless it was all a show, and the US effort was just for appearances.
  - bell-cot 2y ago
    My impression - from a couple articles with "if only we had done X, Y, and Z" regrets & recriminations by former Biden officials - is that Biden & Co. treated Ukraine as an ongoing crisis to manage. (And look good managing.) Not as a war that needed winning. Nor as a problem that actually needed to be fixed. One could speculate that that approach was driven by influence from outside the White House. Especially by the military-industrial complex - which "lost" Afghanistan as bottomless well of spending and career advancement, because ol' Joe finally got America out of there.
    - xenospn 2y ago
      The democrats could’ve used that opportunity to create a new world order. Instead, they fumbled, just like they always do. And now they get to watch from the sidelines.
      - bell-cot 2y ago
        Yeah. But sadly, recent Team R's doesn't seem any better for National Security. The last one I'd call good at it was Bush Sr. On Team D's side, I don't know if I'd credit anyone after FDR with that label. Though Truman and Clinton (ugh) were fairly passable.
        ashoeafoot 2y ago
        a landempire imperial war machine going up against a nearly demented governmentprocess that ala memento forgets everything every 4 years. So of course trump runs
prmph 2y ago
I guess the US got it's mineral deal now, so the justification for continuing to provide more aid to Ukraine has been obtained. The US, especially with Trump at the helm, will not put any more real pressure on Russia. Best they will do is to let things play out as they are now, and if Trump backers ask why the US is still providing some support to Ukraine, he can point to the mineral deal to show that the US is not being Father Christmas.
- sigwinch 2y ago
  Signed yesterday in Kiev
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
jqpabc123 2y ago
So contrary to the repeated promises, the war in Ukraine can't be resolved in 24 hours? Next up --- tariffs really are a tax on US consumers. And a large scale tariff war is simply not winnable. And it is simply not possible to cut $2T from government spending. And defaulting on the national debt will destroy the US economy for a generation. Somebody remind me again --- why did we make "Tariff Man" king? To "Make America Great Again" --- as an isolated, less wealthy and less safe country?
insane_dreamer 2y ago
Wasn't Trump ending the war in Ukraine "on Day 1"? More lies.

13 points by prmph 2y ago

What deal if there is no progress? Art of the deal, Final Chapter: How to make a deal with Putin. You can’t.

So super stupid to think one is going to be able to talk to Russia and convince them giving up a thing, they started by themselves. If they're progressing, constantly acquire land mass, despite sanctions, less earnings and all the backlash put on Russia by the whole world - we're not talking about the humans died for this on both sides. So how is it called if you play poker with someone who's got nothing to lose and still has big enough pockets. That's a big gamble. There's no deal, if the other don't want to. Putin doesn't want. We need more pressure.

quantified 2y ago
Unless it was all a show, and the US effort was just for appearances.
- bell-cot 2y ago
  My impression - from a couple articles with "if only we had done X, Y, and Z" regrets & recriminations by former Biden officials - is that Biden & Co. treated Ukraine as an ongoing crisis to manage. (And look good managing.) Not as a war that needed winning. Nor as a problem that actually needed to be fixed. One could speculate that that approach was driven by influence from outside the White House. Especially by the military-industrial complex - which "lost" Afghanistan as bottomless well of spending and career advancement, because ol' Joe finally got America out of there.
  - xenospn 2y ago
    The democrats could’ve used that opportunity to create a new world order. Instead, they fumbled, just like they always do. And now they get to watch from the sidelines.
    - bell-cot 2y ago
      Yeah. But sadly, recent Team R's doesn't seem any better for National Security. The last one I'd call good at it was Bush Sr. On Team D's side, I don't know if I'd credit anyone after FDR with that label. Though Truman and Clinton (ugh) were fairly passable.
      - ashoeafoot 2y ago
        a landempire imperial war machine going up against a nearly demented governmentprocess that ala memento forgets everything every 4 years. So of course trump runs

prmph 2y ago

I guess the US got it's mineral deal now, so the justification for continuing to provide more aid to Ukraine has been obtained. The US, especially with Trump at the helm, will not put any more real pressure on Russia. Best they will do is to let things play out as they are now, and if Trump backers ask why the US is still providing some support to Ukraine, he can point to the mineral deal to show that the US is not being Father Christmas.

sigwinch 2y ago
Signed yesterday in Kiev

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

jqpabc123 2y ago

So contrary to the repeated promises, the war in Ukraine can't be resolved in 24 hours? Next up --- tariffs really are a tax on US consumers. And a large scale tariff war is simply not winnable. And it is simply not possible to cut $2T from government spending. And defaulting on the national debt will destroy the US economy for a generation. Somebody remind me again --- why did we make "Tariff Man" king? To "Make America Great Again" --- as an isolated, less wealthy and less safe country?

insane_dreamer 2y ago

Wasn't Trump ending the war in Ukraine "on Day 1"? More lies.