3 ms·

My theory is once the novelty wears off and the high tech jaguar carriage is eating margins, public robo taxis will be about as fun to ride in as a public toile

My theory is once the novelty wears off and the high tech jaguar carriage is eating margins, public robo taxis will be about as fun to ride in as a public toilet. The lack of a person and the social pressure that implies (and legal protections) means people will do just about anything in the robotaxi. Cameras and deplatforming will work for a while but it’ll turn into more an accumulation of small things - spilled drinks, garbage left behind - then eventually it’ll be a race to the bottom where most people ride in relative filth while people continue to private cars because they want to avoid sitting in semen stains.

pesus 2y ago
I think the key difference is they can just easily ban you from the service if you damage the vehicle, and every ride is tied to your account from the beginning. Those things can always happen in Uber/Lyft, but I imagine the fees you can receive and the risk of being banned completely keeps it under control.
- LightHugger 2y ago
  I just watched a video where a guy kayak'd down a new york city river with countless electric share scooters thrown into the water by people who just didn't want to pay for a scooter ride. All up and down the river for 8km they were there. I think the OP is on to something.
  - pesus 2y ago
    If we get people somehow managing to toss Waymos into rivers, I think we've got bigger problems...
  - leoqa 2y ago
    Those weren’t riders throwing them in, they were vandals who made a game out of it for social credit.
    - korse 2y ago
      This has been going on for years. A large part of it, at least in my experience, is people who object to scooters being parked in a manner that blocks pedestrian or cyclist paths. One particularly funny incident I'm aware of involved an acquaintance who was overcharged by a scooter company and couldn't get a resolution via support. Being a 'frontier justice' sort of fellow, he rounded up 20+ scooters and chucked them all into a pond in the name of justice.
- jackvalentine 2y ago
  Difference being that now there isn’t a driver there to recognise the damage - now I have to take a million pictures of the inside of my auto taxi and report any damage promptly so I don’t get blamed for the piss covered seats by the next person and banned from the platform. I don’t trust the cameras to capture everything they need to.
pj_mukh 2y ago
"My theory is once the novelty wears off..." FWIW, for a lot of us in the city, the novelties been off for a while. It's now completely replaced uber/lyfts for me, because the driver is a lot more patient, especially with loading children (mini-car seat installation, strollers et al.) and a 100% of my rides have been completely uneventful, no notes, no garbage, no "wAyMo in AccIdeNt". My wife feels safe taking them at night. I realize digital journalism has no space for this, but I wish there was space for the rest of the public to get messages like: "this service came up and is boringly being used as intended".
- skunkworker 2y ago
  Anecdotal, but around college campuses (ASU in particular), many people like Waymo because there isn't a creepy driver in the front seat.
- fnordpiglet 2y ago
  Right but this is now. The novelty is still there and margin compression hasn’t really happened yet. Being a loss leading jaguar vehicle with plenty of off time to clean and reputational concerns are still top of mind. Novelty here didn’t mean for you - it meant for companies operating driverless cars. The next step is enshitification then dive to bottom minimal margin maximal volume businesses. Of course major infractions will be caught. Taking a dump in the Waymo on camera will be punished. But the small incremental dirtying caused by constant and increasingly negligent use unmediated by social cohesion will lead to the public bathroom effect. Margin compression will require taxis reduce amenities and increase time between service stops. There will probably be tiered services but the bottom tier will be disgusting. I’ll put my $20 on it now.
tziki 2y ago
As long as they have your credit card on file you have an incentive to behave.
boxedemp 2y ago
The last Uber I took, the driver told me my country wasn't a real country and basically I have no identity. Human interaction always positive, and they can ban the bad riders or charge their credit cards.
akudha 2y ago
I wonder how much of this would happen in a place like Japan or Korea. I haven't been to those countries, but heard that they have higher standards of cleanliness and people generally don't litter etc
- floydnoel 2y ago
  i've actually read that people litter constantly in japan, but highly vigilant workers are always cleaning it up.

pesus 2y ago

I think the key difference is they can just easily ban you from the service if you damage the vehicle, and every ride is tied to your account from the beginning. Those things can always happen in Uber/Lyft, but I imagine the fees you can receive and the risk of being banned completely keeps it under control.

LightHugger 2y ago
I just watched a video where a guy kayak'd down a new york city river with countless electric share scooters thrown into the water by people who just didn't want to pay for a scooter ride. All up and down the river for 8km they were there. I think the OP is on to something.
- pesus 2y ago
  If we get people somehow managing to toss Waymos into rivers, I think we've got bigger problems...
- leoqa 2y ago
  Those weren’t riders throwing them in, they were vandals who made a game out of it for social credit.
  - korse 2y ago
    This has been going on for years. A large part of it, at least in my experience, is people who object to scooters being parked in a manner that blocks pedestrian or cyclist paths. One particularly funny incident I'm aware of involved an acquaintance who was overcharged by a scooter company and couldn't get a resolution via support. Being a 'frontier justice' sort of fellow, he rounded up 20+ scooters and chucked them all into a pond in the name of justice.
jackvalentine 2y ago
Difference being that now there isn’t a driver there to recognise the damage - now I have to take a million pictures of the inside of my auto taxi and report any damage promptly so I don’t get blamed for the piss covered seats by the next person and banned from the platform. I don’t trust the cameras to capture everything they need to.

pj_mukh 2y ago

"My theory is once the novelty wears off..." FWIW, for a lot of us in the city, the novelties been off for a while. It's now completely replaced uber/lyfts for me, because the driver is a lot more patient, especially with loading children (mini-car seat installation, strollers et al.) and a 100% of my rides have been completely uneventful, no notes, no garbage, no "wAyMo in AccIdeNt". My wife feels safe taking them at night. I realize digital journalism has no space for this, but I wish there was space for the rest of the public to get messages like: "this service came up and is boringly being used as intended".

skunkworker 2y ago
Anecdotal, but around college campuses (ASU in particular), many people like Waymo because there isn't a creepy driver in the front seat.
fnordpiglet 2y ago
Right but this is now. The novelty is still there and margin compression hasn’t really happened yet. Being a loss leading jaguar vehicle with plenty of off time to clean and reputational concerns are still top of mind. Novelty here didn’t mean for you - it meant for companies operating driverless cars. The next step is enshitification then dive to bottom minimal margin maximal volume businesses. Of course major infractions will be caught. Taking a dump in the Waymo on camera will be punished. But the small incremental dirtying caused by constant and increasingly negligent use unmediated by social cohesion will lead to the public bathroom effect. Margin compression will require taxis reduce amenities and increase time between service stops. There will probably be tiered services but the bottom tier will be disgusting. I’ll put my $20 on it now.

tziki 2y ago

As long as they have your credit card on file you have an incentive to behave.

boxedemp 2y ago

The last Uber I took, the driver told me my country wasn't a real country and basically I have no identity. Human interaction always positive, and they can ban the bad riders or charge their credit cards.

akudha 2y ago

I wonder how much of this would happen in a place like Japan or Korea. I haven't been to those countries, but heard that they have higher standards of cleanliness and people generally don't litter etc

floydnoel 2y ago
i've actually read that people litter constantly in japan, but highly vigilant workers are always cleaning it up.