4 ms·

Installing packages (like podman or moby/docker) using dnf and apt requires root as well, so I'm not sure what your point is.

pydry 2y ago
making systemd - a root service - a necessary dependency in order to orchestrate > 1 nonroot containers is both unnecessary and bad architecture. It was a shitty decision that renders it just "a less popular docker" and not "a better docker".
- linuxandrew 2y ago
  Podman doesn't have a dependency on systemd. e.g. it is packaged in Void Linux. Podman has a better architecture than Docker in that it can easily run on a non-privileged user. Quadlet (aka podman-systemd.unit) is a podman-systemd integration which can make it easy to launch and orchestrate podman containers via systemd. You can get all if the systemd dependency handling, require other units to run after a container finishes, and all sorts of other useful things. Systemd "user" units (systemctl --user) also works here with the containers running as a non-privileged user in a non-root systemd context. Just to be clear, Quadlet is just an integration and you can still run podman without it. You can still run podman on non-systemd systems as well.
  - dharmab 2y ago
    And you can use podman to run multiple containers together (as a Pod). With or without systemd.
  - pydry 2y ago
    >Podman doesn't have a dependency on systemd Just to be clear we're talking about QUADLETS, red hat's recommended way to orchestrate containers. >Just to be clear, Quadlet is just an integration and you can still run podman without it. Just to be clear, nobody was unclear about that. It is, just to be clear, red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers despite having this nasty dependency analogous to the one docker has on a root service. Hope that helps.
    - coldtea 2y ago
      >Just to be clear, nobody was unclear about that Oh, you were quite unclear. Also wrong in saying you need systemd with podman to orchestrate multiple containers without root. >It is, just to be clear, red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers despite having this nasty dependency analogous to the one docker has on a root service. It's not "red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers" in general. It's "red hat's recommended way to orchestrate containers on top of systemd", that its whole point. Nothing nasty about it either, you'd already be running systemd on your redhat system (and many non red-hat ones).
      - pydry 2y ago
        >Also wrong in saying you need systemd with podman to orchestrate multiple containers without root I explicitly said thay it wasnt needed and that there werent other ways just that it was the recommended way. >It's not "red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers It is.
- exceptione 2y ago
  wut? Containers need an operating system. systemd runs on a linux host, the rootless container runs on a linux host, controlled by `systemctl --user ...`.
  - esseph 2y ago
    But you don't understand, it also needs an operating system therefore it is vulnerable, because things on it run as root! /s

pydry 2y ago

making systemd - a root service - a necessary dependency in order to orchestrate > 1 nonroot containers is both unnecessary and bad architecture. It was a shitty decision that renders it just "a less popular docker" and not "a better docker".

linuxandrew 2y ago
Podman doesn't have a dependency on systemd. e.g. it is packaged in Void Linux. Podman has a better architecture than Docker in that it can easily run on a non-privileged user. Quadlet (aka podman-systemd.unit) is a podman-systemd integration which can make it easy to launch and orchestrate podman containers via systemd. You can get all if the systemd dependency handling, require other units to run after a container finishes, and all sorts of other useful things. Systemd "user" units (systemctl --user) also works here with the containers running as a non-privileged user in a non-root systemd context. Just to be clear, Quadlet is just an integration and you can still run podman without it. You can still run podman on non-systemd systems as well.
- dharmab 2y ago
  And you can use podman to run multiple containers together (as a Pod). With or without systemd.
- pydry 2y ago
  >Podman doesn't have a dependency on systemd Just to be clear we're talking about QUADLETS, red hat's recommended way to orchestrate containers. >Just to be clear, Quadlet is just an integration and you can still run podman without it. Just to be clear, nobody was unclear about that. It is, just to be clear, red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers despite having this nasty dependency analogous to the one docker has on a root service. Hope that helps.
  - coldtea 2y ago
    >Just to be clear, nobody was unclear about that Oh, you were quite unclear. Also wrong in saying you need systemd with podman to orchestrate multiple containers without root. >It is, just to be clear, red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers despite having this nasty dependency analogous to the one docker has on a root service. It's not "red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers" in general. It's "red hat's recommended way to orchestrate containers on top of systemd", that its whole point. Nothing nasty about it either, you'd already be running systemd on your redhat system (and many non red-hat ones).
    - pydry 2y ago
      >Also wrong in saying you need systemd with podman to orchestrate multiple containers without root I explicitly said thay it wasnt needed and that there werent other ways just that it was the recommended way. >It's not "red hat's recommended way to orchestrate podman containers It is.
exceptione 2y ago
wut? Containers need an operating system. systemd runs on a linux host, the rootless container runs on a linux host, controlled by `systemctl --user ...`.
- esseph 2y ago
  But you don't understand, it also needs an operating system therefore it is vulnerable, because things on it run as root! /s