4 ms·

I don't think AI addiction is actually a thing. Whoever is using chatbots obsessively, is using on others, not on themselves. Not to fill a void, but to play a

I don't think AI addiction is actually a thing. Whoever is using chatbots obsessively, is using on others, not on themselves. Not to fill a void, but to play and harass other humans. "Digital waifus" are old decade stuff, a very narrow market that has very low value. Those people aren't even addicted, it has become a healthy hobbyst culture. If you are serious about mental health, the real issue right now is the growing "incel" supergroup of targeted "dangerous" personas. That also has nothing to do with addiction. Those kids need real friends, AI companions _will_ be an extra insult to them, not a pax to fill some hypothetical void. They are not lonely and sad (that's the label people put on them), they are desensitized.

squigz 2y ago
> the real issue right now is the growing "incel" supergroup of targeted "dangerous" personas Can you elaborate on this, particularly on how we might solve that issue?
- alganet 2y ago
  Sure. To solve it powerful people need to stop using younger generations as personality cannon fodder for cultural and political disputes.
  - squigz 2y ago
    Now I'm even more unclear on what exactly it is you're talking about.
    - alganet 2y ago
      In simple terms, I am talking about making kind human beings that are not fools. But that is a very generic description. The idea of AI companions plays with the notion of the 2020s "incel". A sad boy who can't get a girlfriend and spend time with games and digital toys. There is no other possible audience for a product like this. My assessment is that this interpretation is wrong, and those kids are not sad and lonely. That "personality" has been shaped and used online for all kinds of purposes. I think deep down they know that and will see the "digital girl" product as an insult. The fact that this demography uses LLMs is not a tell that they need someone to chat. Those kids are using AI chatbot content on others, not themselves. What they want is an LLM thug or bully agent to retaliate who mocks them. What they really need though is a friend, who can understand a little bit of what they went through, and that won't try to use them for some shady purpose or mock them. They will eventually realize that tech is not that friend, and have been manipulating them all along. Take some time to think about these issues before dismissing my point. I know you will dismiss my point, but take the time to do so. Thinking about humans as humans is important.
      - squigz 2y ago
        > There is no other possible audience for a product like this. I think you greatly underestimate how widespread and serious loneliness has become, if you think that "sad teenage boy who can't get girlfriend" is the only audience for this. I know many people of various ages who have expressed interest in this, and none of them are what anyone would call "incels" Friendship and community is not as common as it should be for a huge amount of people, and AI companions will appeal to anyone who feels lonely enough.
        alganet 2y ago
        "expressed interest" is a funny market research term. As I mentioned, my assessment is that "expressed interest" might not be what it really seems to be. Of course other groups have "interest", but the real market are incels, isn't it? The other demographics are that expressive of a target? We'll see. I can't change how things go, and companies are stubborn and will develop it anyway in some form or another.
        squigz 2y ago
        > "expressed interest" is a funny market research term. I don't even know what you're trying to say here. > As I mentioned, my assessment is that "expressed interest" might not be what it really seems to be. Yes well I'm not sure how it really seems to be to you. You say these groups aren't lonely, but what they really need are friends...?
        alganet 2y ago
        Yes. Friends in the sense I explained before. Someone who understands, is real, and do not want to use them for profit or disputes. It's not hard to grasp. An AI bot is not a friend, it is insulting. If I'm right it will be rejected or misused.
        squigz 2y ago
        You are right, in that people need real friends. You are wrong, in that people will turn to these products. I am telling you this after discussing such things at lengths with people, including the pros and cons of it, and why such things appeal to them. My conclusion is certainly not that they feel insulted by it. Feel free to dismiss that anecdote as, I don't know, 'market research' or something.

squigz 2y ago

> the real issue right now is the growing "incel" supergroup of targeted "dangerous" personas Can you elaborate on this, particularly on how we might solve that issue?

alganet 2y ago
Sure. To solve it powerful people need to stop using younger generations as personality cannon fodder for cultural and political disputes.
- squigz 2y ago
  Now I'm even more unclear on what exactly it is you're talking about.
  - alganet 2y ago
    In simple terms, I am talking about making kind human beings that are not fools. But that is a very generic description. The idea of AI companions plays with the notion of the 2020s "incel". A sad boy who can't get a girlfriend and spend time with games and digital toys. There is no other possible audience for a product like this. My assessment is that this interpretation is wrong, and those kids are not sad and lonely. That "personality" has been shaped and used online for all kinds of purposes. I think deep down they know that and will see the "digital girl" product as an insult. The fact that this demography uses LLMs is not a tell that they need someone to chat. Those kids are using AI chatbot content on others, not themselves. What they want is an LLM thug or bully agent to retaliate who mocks them. What they really need though is a friend, who can understand a little bit of what they went through, and that won't try to use them for some shady purpose or mock them. They will eventually realize that tech is not that friend, and have been manipulating them all along. Take some time to think about these issues before dismissing my point. I know you will dismiss my point, but take the time to do so. Thinking about humans as humans is important.
    - squigz 2y ago
      > There is no other possible audience for a product like this. I think you greatly underestimate how widespread and serious loneliness has become, if you think that "sad teenage boy who can't get girlfriend" is the only audience for this. I know many people of various ages who have expressed interest in this, and none of them are what anyone would call "incels" Friendship and community is not as common as it should be for a huge amount of people, and AI companions will appeal to anyone who feels lonely enough.
      - alganet 2y ago
        "expressed interest" is a funny market research term. As I mentioned, my assessment is that "expressed interest" might not be what it really seems to be. Of course other groups have "interest", but the real market are incels, isn't it? The other demographics are that expressive of a target? We'll see. I can't change how things go, and companies are stubborn and will develop it anyway in some form or another.
        squigz 2y ago
        > "expressed interest" is a funny market research term. I don't even know what you're trying to say here. > As I mentioned, my assessment is that "expressed interest" might not be what it really seems to be. Yes well I'm not sure how it really seems to be to you. You say these groups aren't lonely, but what they really need are friends...?
        alganet 2y ago
        Yes. Friends in the sense I explained before. Someone who understands, is real, and do not want to use them for profit or disputes. It's not hard to grasp. An AI bot is not a friend, it is insulting. If I'm right it will be rejected or misused.
        squigz 2y ago
        You are right, in that people need real friends. You are wrong, in that people will turn to these products. I am telling you this after discussing such things at lengths with people, including the pros and cons of it, and why such things appeal to them. My conclusion is certainly not that they feel insulted by it. Feel free to dismiss that anecdote as, I don't know, 'market research' or something.