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Indeed. The editorial boards of these newsrooms are often staffed with people who attended the same schools and classes as those running the country. The social

Indeed. The editorial boards of these newsrooms are often staffed with people who attended the same schools and classes as those running the country. The social circles of the two worlds are extremely closely linked. Of course, this means that the reporting isn't very good at addressing its blind spots–i.e., most of the news in the country, let alone the world, that isn't relevant to the ivy league coastal elites. And I say this as a member of that same class. Most of the political perspectives in my life are completely unrepresented in the opinion columns, which generally tend to pander upwards rather than downwards. I don't tend to put much weight in freedom of the press so long as that press is floating on the cream of society and asking the government permission to report on what they're doing.

shihab 1y ago
The NYT's Executive Editor Joe Kahn is the son of a billionaire who was on the board of lobby group CAMERA, a group devoted to pressuring US media to be more pro-Israel.
- EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 1y ago
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  - shihab 1y ago
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    - EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 1y ago
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      - MPSFounder 1y ago
        [flagged]
        OhioMan2943 1y ago
        I've had this myself when trying to argue a point on a previous Palestine post on HN months ago. They essentially listed off all of the generic antisemetic tropes as fast as they could, trying to tie themself to me while contributing nothing to the discussion.
- mmooss 1y ago
  Just rumors and conspiracy theories. Where can we see evidence of what you claim? What do you claim Kahn has done? Do you have evidence? The NY Times regulary publishes news critical of Israel. Children and parents, siblings, etc. disagree, sometimes extremely, regularly. Children and parents disagreeing is one of the most common stories in humanity. Should Joe resign because of dad's activities?
  - jgil 1y ago
    Not OP but -- there is reporting by The Intercept on a leak of guidance that explicitly contains double standards. [1] Before the leak there was already data-driven analysis about coverage that, in aggregate, shows imbalance. [2] 1 - https://archive.ph/eEwi0 https://archive.ph/eEwi0 2 - https://archive.ph/fp4vQ https://archive.ph/fp4vQ
  - ImPostingOnHN 1y ago
    > Where can we see evidence of what you claim? This is not only a reasonable question, but it is a good one, too. Unfortunately, the line beforehand: > Just rumors and conspiracy theories. ...makes it seem like you've already made up your mind, and makes it difficult to interpret your post as a good-faith attempt on your part to learn something new from someone.
    - mmooss 1y ago
      The issue that matters is not me, whoever I am and whatever I think, it's the claims made by the GGP. Which remain worthless until proven otherwise, like all other claims.
shihab 1y ago
And here is an article on Raffi berg, BBC’s Middle East editor: https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/bbc-civil-war-gaza-israel-biased-coverage https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/bbc-civil-war-gaza-israel-bia...
- YZF 1y ago
  And here is an analysis of BBC's anti-Israeli bias: https://asserson.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/asserson-report.pdf https://asserson.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/asserson-r... And from the BBC itself: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c2d4egk17l2o https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c2d4egk17l2o "Questions still remain for BBC after damaging Gaza documentary" https://www.ynetnews.com/culture/article/skcfkb1iyx https://www.ynetnews.com/culture/article/skcfkb1iyx "From bias to blunders: The BBC’s anti-Israel shift since October 7"
  - KingMob 1y ago
    And opposite all that are Tiktok videos by Israeli soldiers, for which questions of journalistic bias are irrelevant.
    - YZF 1y ago
      Bad things happen in wars. And yes there are questionable videos of Israeli soldiers on TikTok. I'm not sure how this supports your view point. It's is entirely possible for Israel to be the good guy, for the BBC to have a strong anti-Israeli bias, and for there to be questionable actions by certain Israeli soldiers (including on TikTok). There are also questionable actions by Ukrainian soldiers and there have been questionable actions by American, British, and Australian soldiers in their war on ISIS and Al Qaeda and there have been questionable action by the allies in WW-II. Israeli soldiers are young adults fighting an enemy that has complete disregard to human life (theirs or others) or pretty much anything else. That enemy has been attacking them for decades. Many of them may have friends and family that have been impacted by this enemy's brutality. So yes- there are going to be questionable incidents. This is human nature. We can fix this by forcing Hamas to release the hostages, surrender, and end this war. Could have happened a long time ago if the pressure was on the right side. You can't get a picture of reality through anecdotes. In every war you can cherry pick any narrative. For what its worth I've spoken to soldiers who fought in Gaza and they maintain they hold high standards and the incidents you hear of are outliers.
banannaise 1y ago
More importantly, these newsrooms are run by people who get their money from the same places. How much are they going to tolerate narratives that go against their financial interests?
- mmooss 1y ago
  Just endless conspiracies. Which newsroom leaders get their money from what places? Why do leaders in government and business hate journalists so much and invest so much in discrediting them?
  - DrFalkyn 1y ago
    The Washington Post being owned by Amazon for one
    - Braxton1980 1y ago
      I believe he was referring to the constant barrage of anti-media rhetoric by Republicans. You can't trust the main stream media, the legacy media is lying, etc Why would they do this it the media is controlled by them?
      - immibis 1y ago
        Because their constituents are really so dumb they don't believe Fox News is mainstream media?
      - NoTeslaThrow 1y ago
        Republican voters can see many if not all of the same economic ills in society that Democrat voters do. In some cases they can even agree on the cause. I'm not going to stand next to how right-wing media (and its eager audience) may characterize "main stream media". But I do think the window of representation across how americans see and characterize ourselves through newsrooms in general has narrowed too far (in its seemingly-permanently partisan polarization) to sustain a rational democracy. Social media and the internet have provided the means to see this clearer than ever, in both great and terrible ways. A lot of contradictions in society about values we have and language we use as a people will have to resolve now. All I can say is I hope we see a real economic policy response from democrats in congress, and fast. They seem to be fishing around for ideas in all the wrong pockets (foreign interests, domestic private interests, namely not the daily interests of the majority of their constituents).... but even rhetorically, it would be a start.
mmooss 1y ago
> The editorial boards of these newsrooms are often staffed with people who attended the same schools and classes as those running the country. The social circles of the two worlds are extremely closely linked. This is a conspiracy theory - they are secretly conspiring. Do you have evidence of this conspiracy actually happening on any scale? Many attended the same universities on all sides of politics and issues. The universities are big places that have been operating for generations. Ask someone who went to a university - do they know and agree with everyone else who went there? It's absurd. > most of the news in the country, let alone the world, that isn't relevant to the ivy league coastal elites. You need to do more than throw around stereotypes. Give us some evidence. > I don't tend to put much weight in freedom of the press so long as that press is floating on the cream of society and asking the government permission to report on what they're doing. Who asked permission?
- NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
  >This is a conspiracy theory Doesn't meet the criteria of what people typically call a conspiracy theory. It's easily verified or debunked by amateurs with publicly available information, it doesn't seem absurd on its face, and it makes no claims other than those of association (certainly none of blatant felony, coup, or world domination).
  - jl6 1y ago
    > no claims other than those of association Yeah but that’s how modern conspiracy theories work. They have evolved beyond the old staples like flat earth and moon landing stuff which make clear statements. They instead just insinuate. And that’s enough to achieve the intended effect: to move your predispositions, while remaining immune to debunking because they haven’t made any specific claim.
    - NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
      >Yeah but that’s how modern conspiracy theories work. T That is indeed how modern conspiracy theories work. They make outlandish claims that aren't supported by scientific fact, that some shadowy group controls the world through improbable means, and offer no evidence. "Hey, these two groups are awfully cozy together" just isn't even close to being anything like a conspiracy theory. You've stretched your fallacious counter-argument too far.
Braxton1980 1y ago
Which politcal perspective is being ignored by the media?
rayiner 1y ago
[flagged]
- woooooo 1y ago
  Worth considering if this is what you voted for. Was the moment of pique worth it?
  - rayiner 1y ago
    I’d rather have JD than Trump, but otherwise I’m thrilled. I don’t know what you mean by “moment of pique.” Ross Perot got like 20% of the vote. MAGA basically realigns the GOP to absorb the Ross Perot Democrats and Buchanan Republicans while pushing out the neocons. It’s not a new set of political beliefs.
    - woooooo 1y ago
      By "pique", I mean that the motivating factor I've heard from most Trump people, and that I'm reading from your posts, is "make the libs cry". First term was fine, he was mostly harmless and made the libs cry every day with fake culture war stuff. In 2024 I get the impression people were voting for a repeat of that, not some crazy reconfiguration of the entire economy. Trump ran on "they're making your kids trans and the Somalis are eating dogs", not "we will end global trade and deport anyone who criticizes Israel".
      - rayiner 1y ago
        It’s the same ideology being pushed by the same people. In particular, mass immigration and free trade are two sides of the same globalization coin. And stopping outsourcing was #5 on Trump’s platform: https://www.donaldjtrump.com/platform https://www.donaldjtrump.com/platform

shihab 1y ago

The NYT's Executive Editor Joe Kahn is the son of a billionaire who was on the board of lobby group CAMERA, a group devoted to pressuring US media to be more pro-Israel.

EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 1y ago
[flagged]
- shihab 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - EVa5I7bHFq9mnYK 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - MPSFounder 1y ago
      [flagged]
      - OhioMan2943 1y ago
        I've had this myself when trying to argue a point on a previous Palestine post on HN months ago. They essentially listed off all of the generic antisemetic tropes as fast as they could, trying to tie themself to me while contributing nothing to the discussion.
mmooss 1y ago
Just rumors and conspiracy theories. Where can we see evidence of what you claim? What do you claim Kahn has done? Do you have evidence? The NY Times regulary publishes news critical of Israel. Children and parents, siblings, etc. disagree, sometimes extremely, regularly. Children and parents disagreeing is one of the most common stories in humanity. Should Joe resign because of dad's activities?
- jgil 1y ago
  Not OP but -- there is reporting by The Intercept on a leak of guidance that explicitly contains double standards. [1] Before the leak there was already data-driven analysis about coverage that, in aggregate, shows imbalance. [2] 1 - https://archive.ph/eEwi0 https://archive.ph/eEwi0 2 - https://archive.ph/fp4vQ https://archive.ph/fp4vQ
- ImPostingOnHN 1y ago
  > Where can we see evidence of what you claim? This is not only a reasonable question, but it is a good one, too. Unfortunately, the line beforehand: > Just rumors and conspiracy theories. ...makes it seem like you've already made up your mind, and makes it difficult to interpret your post as a good-faith attempt on your part to learn something new from someone.
  - mmooss 1y ago
    The issue that matters is not me, whoever I am and whatever I think, it's the claims made by the GGP. Which remain worthless until proven otherwise, like all other claims.

shihab 1y ago

And here is an article on Raffi berg, BBC’s Middle East editor: https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/bbc-civil-war-gaza-israel-biased-coverage https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/bbc-civil-war-gaza-israel-bia...

YZF 1y ago
And here is an analysis of BBC's anti-Israeli bias: https://asserson.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/asserson-report.pdf https://asserson.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/09/asserson-r... And from the BBC itself: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c2d4egk17l2o https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c2d4egk17l2o "Questions still remain for BBC after damaging Gaza documentary" https://www.ynetnews.com/culture/article/skcfkb1iyx https://www.ynetnews.com/culture/article/skcfkb1iyx "From bias to blunders: The BBC’s anti-Israel shift since October 7"
- KingMob 1y ago
  And opposite all that are Tiktok videos by Israeli soldiers, for which questions of journalistic bias are irrelevant.
  - YZF 1y ago
    Bad things happen in wars. And yes there are questionable videos of Israeli soldiers on TikTok. I'm not sure how this supports your view point. It's is entirely possible for Israel to be the good guy, for the BBC to have a strong anti-Israeli bias, and for there to be questionable actions by certain Israeli soldiers (including on TikTok). There are also questionable actions by Ukrainian soldiers and there have been questionable actions by American, British, and Australian soldiers in their war on ISIS and Al Qaeda and there have been questionable action by the allies in WW-II. Israeli soldiers are young adults fighting an enemy that has complete disregard to human life (theirs or others) or pretty much anything else. That enemy has been attacking them for decades. Many of them may have friends and family that have been impacted by this enemy's brutality. So yes- there are going to be questionable incidents. This is human nature. We can fix this by forcing Hamas to release the hostages, surrender, and end this war. Could have happened a long time ago if the pressure was on the right side. You can't get a picture of reality through anecdotes. In every war you can cherry pick any narrative. For what its worth I've spoken to soldiers who fought in Gaza and they maintain they hold high standards and the incidents you hear of are outliers.

banannaise 1y ago

More importantly, these newsrooms are run by people who get their money from the same places. How much are they going to tolerate narratives that go against their financial interests?

mmooss 1y ago
Just endless conspiracies. Which newsroom leaders get their money from what places? Why do leaders in government and business hate journalists so much and invest so much in discrediting them?
- DrFalkyn 1y ago
  The Washington Post being owned by Amazon for one
  - Braxton1980 1y ago
    I believe he was referring to the constant barrage of anti-media rhetoric by Republicans. You can't trust the main stream media, the legacy media is lying, etc Why would they do this it the media is controlled by them?
    - immibis 1y ago
      Because their constituents are really so dumb they don't believe Fox News is mainstream media?
    - NoTeslaThrow 1y ago
      Republican voters can see many if not all of the same economic ills in society that Democrat voters do. In some cases they can even agree on the cause. I'm not going to stand next to how right-wing media (and its eager audience) may characterize "main stream media". But I do think the window of representation across how americans see and characterize ourselves through newsrooms in general has narrowed too far (in its seemingly-permanently partisan polarization) to sustain a rational democracy. Social media and the internet have provided the means to see this clearer than ever, in both great and terrible ways. A lot of contradictions in society about values we have and language we use as a people will have to resolve now. All I can say is I hope we see a real economic policy response from democrats in congress, and fast. They seem to be fishing around for ideas in all the wrong pockets (foreign interests, domestic private interests, namely not the daily interests of the majority of their constituents).... but even rhetorically, it would be a start.

mmooss 1y ago

> The editorial boards of these newsrooms are often staffed with people who attended the same schools and classes as those running the country. The social circles of the two worlds are extremely closely linked. This is a conspiracy theory - they are secretly conspiring. Do you have evidence of this conspiracy actually happening on any scale? Many attended the same universities on all sides of politics and issues. The universities are big places that have been operating for generations. Ask someone who went to a university - do they know and agree with everyone else who went there? It's absurd. > most of the news in the country, let alone the world, that isn't relevant to the ivy league coastal elites. You need to do more than throw around stereotypes. Give us some evidence. > I don't tend to put much weight in freedom of the press so long as that press is floating on the cream of society and asking the government permission to report on what they're doing. Who asked permission?

NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
>This is a conspiracy theory Doesn't meet the criteria of what people typically call a conspiracy theory. It's easily verified or debunked by amateurs with publicly available information, it doesn't seem absurd on its face, and it makes no claims other than those of association (certainly none of blatant felony, coup, or world domination).
- jl6 1y ago
  > no claims other than those of association Yeah but that’s how modern conspiracy theories work. They have evolved beyond the old staples like flat earth and moon landing stuff which make clear statements. They instead just insinuate. And that’s enough to achieve the intended effect: to move your predispositions, while remaining immune to debunking because they haven’t made any specific claim.
  - NoMoreNicksLeft 1y ago
    >Yeah but that’s how modern conspiracy theories work. T That is indeed how modern conspiracy theories work. They make outlandish claims that aren't supported by scientific fact, that some shadowy group controls the world through improbable means, and offer no evidence. "Hey, these two groups are awfully cozy together" just isn't even close to being anything like a conspiracy theory. You've stretched your fallacious counter-argument too far.

Braxton1980 1y ago

Which politcal perspective is being ignored by the media?

rayiner 1y ago

[flagged]

woooooo 1y ago
Worth considering if this is what you voted for. Was the moment of pique worth it?
- rayiner 1y ago
  I’d rather have JD than Trump, but otherwise I’m thrilled. I don’t know what you mean by “moment of pique.” Ross Perot got like 20% of the vote. MAGA basically realigns the GOP to absorb the Ross Perot Democrats and Buchanan Republicans while pushing out the neocons. It’s not a new set of political beliefs.
  - woooooo 1y ago
    By "pique", I mean that the motivating factor I've heard from most Trump people, and that I'm reading from your posts, is "make the libs cry". First term was fine, he was mostly harmless and made the libs cry every day with fake culture war stuff. In 2024 I get the impression people were voting for a repeat of that, not some crazy reconfiguration of the entire economy. Trump ran on "they're making your kids trans and the Somalis are eating dogs", not "we will end global trade and deport anyone who criticizes Israel".
    - rayiner 1y ago
      It’s the same ideology being pushed by the same people. In particular, mass immigration and free trade are two sides of the same globalization coin. And stopping outsourcing was #5 on Trump’s platform: https://www.donaldjtrump.com/platform https://www.donaldjtrump.com/platform