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ICE director envisions Amazon-like mass deportation system
- salviati 2y agoLet me think of a past example where a deportation machinery was built and fine tuned... It went well, right? Very efficient. Incredibly efficient. The world had never seen something so efficient before.
- _def 2y agoIBM would be an experienced partner
- Tostino 2y agoLet's hope they don't get with I.G. Farben for their 'expertise'. I'm not joking at this point.
- blitzar 2y agoPowered by beautiful, beautiful clean coal.
- Kichererbsen 2y agoThis is how a nation gets a reputation for being efficient. It's a pre-requisite for making and selling cars I guess?
- Philpax 2y ago> “We need to get better at treating this like a business,” Acting ICE Director Todd Lyons said, explaining he wants to see a deportation process “like (Amazon) Prime, but with human beings.” This is one of the most evil things I've seen posted on HN.
- throwccp 2y agoAmerica is only for Europeans. I don't know how these Europeans act when natives ask them to leave
- adityaathalye 2y agoCue: "Don't Create the Torment Nexus" meme. Aside: Seems like a natural line of thinking in a country with a thriving privatised prison system.
- slillibri 2y agoNationally, there are less than 10% of incarcerated people in private prisons. This number starts to vary widely from state to state though, with some states having more than 50% and some having 0%.
- aredox 2y agoPublic prisons's use of forced labor is not better than private ones. And people in prisons (private or public) count towards total population in counties, giving them more weight in elections, despite none of the prisoners having chosen to be there voluntarily nor having the right to vote. https://www.vera.org/news/how-mass-incarceration-shapes-our-elections https://www.vera.org/news/how-mass-incarceration-shapes-our-...
- slillibri 2y agoTrue, but there is this mythology that all prisons in the USA are private prisons controlled solely by corporations, which is wildly untrue. Public prisons aren't much better than private prisons, due to the fact that they are just punishment and not rehabilitation. On your second point, undocumented immigrants also count in the census and give more weight in representation and elections, even though they cannot vote. In a perfect world, we would expect elected officials to represent all of their constituents, not just those who voted for them, but we are far from that.
- aredox 2y ago>On your second point, undocumented immigrants also count in the census Except immigrants choose where they want to live. The prisoners are where they are because the party in power (usually Republican, borderline neo-Confederate) creates laws that lead to extensive incarceration (such as "three strikes") and is the one which decides where to build prisons, which results in biased elections in their favor. Which reeks of the pre-civil war rules that slaves count for political weight.
- Nesco 2y ago[flagged]
- InsideOutSanta 2y agoIt's also stupid, even if you're a complete sociopath. "Let's ship 3% of our economy to other countries." These people work, buy things, and pay taxes. Just rapturing them out of the country will not benefit anyone.
- yaris 2y agoWell, it will definitely benefit the people listed in the article and their friends at contractor companies. As for economic or moral aspects - those in power to not give a flying fcuk, it seems.
- Nesco 2y agoThen why do you not have a full open-order policy? It will definitely grow the nominal size of the economy
- InsideOutSanta 2y agoDon't know if that helps, but I'm not a country.
- Nesco 2y agoYou could grow the nominal wealth of your household by removing the lock
- InsideOutSanta 2y agoI believe your analogy is trying to liken immigrants to thieves, which is precisely why it's not a good analogy.
- Nesco 2y agoNo, in fact you did! I knew a good friend who lived in Okinawa, and never locked his front door even when going abroad
- blitzar 2y agoWe don't talk enough around here about how dehumanising Amazons (and many tech companies) approach to human workers is.
- throweuo 2y ago[dead]
- rob74 2y agoAlso, I would argue that ICE needs less perverse incentives, not more. It's pretty obvious that they have deportation quotas that they have to meet or exceed, hence hapless tourists get treated like dangerous criminals and locked up for weeks (because the detention centers are also commercial, so the longer people stay, the better for them) before eventually being deported: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/19/canadian-detained-us-immigration-jasmine-mooney https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/19/canadian-det...
- jeetoid 2y agoI don’t think deportation is evil. In fact I applaud this.
- AlecSchueler 2y agoCan you see how this comes across as double speak?
- JohnTHaller 2y ago... so far. We're only 80 days into this Republican administration.
- quadragenarian 2y agoAnother example of the idea that "treating people like objects" is evil and in fact, is the cause of most evil in the world.
- neerd 2y agoI’m not the only one who gets a chill down their spine when they hear this, right? I hate to invoke Godwin's law on the very first comment on a post, but the industrialization of deportations seems to have alarming parallels to the mass murder Jews and other minority groups in 1930’s and 40’s Europe. I read “Ordinary Men” by Christopher Browning a couple months ago and the thing that stuck out to me is that when the Nazi’s started killing people, they didn’t immediately jump to death camps. The initial steps of the holocaust began as a “deportation” scheme and it was a continual ramping up of the scale of murder. They initially claimed they were going to deport these people to Madagascar https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madagascar_Plan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madagascar_Plan I’m not American so I may be missing some nuance here, but this seems a little terrifying to me.
- charcircuit 2y ago[flagged]
- operationcwal 2y ago[flagged]
- aydyn 2y ago[flagged]
- ggm 2y agoS/need/absent legal process we'd, that is some of us, would like/ It's a debate, right? I get the current ruling party believes it has a mandate, but could you at least acknowledge a plurality of views on this? I argue there is no need. Its fictive, performative. These are productive people. Even the drug gangs are simply doing what citizens also do.
- InsideOutSanta 2y ago>I argue there is no need This is the wildest thing about all of this. This is not a problem to begin with. The "solution" is the actual problem, and the problem—people who want to live and work in the US—benefits US society.
- tirpen 2y ago"Evil begins when you begin to treat people as things." -Terry Pratchett
- FirmwareBurner 2y agoCompanies have been doing that for a long time now. You're not a person, you're an ID number in the payroll database, that needs to produce more profit than you cost the company. When you emigrate to another country, you're viewed much the same way as a non-citizen by the system.
- gloxkiqcza 2y agoEven in your own country you’re viewed the same way, it’s just that your database entry has higher privileges. I mean this universally, no particular country in mind.
- vanderZwan 2y agoWell, although this particular quote is from a book from 2010, Terry Pratchett had been writing about these kinds of problems for decades at that point too, so that fits. For example, in Reaper Man from 1991 shopping malls were invasive parasitical life-forms from another universe.
- fxmc 2y ago"If there is such a phenomenon as absolute evil, it consists in treating another human being as a thing." — John Brunner, "The Shockwave Rider"
- padolsey 2y agoWhen recently visiting, what shocked me most about the CBP–which I presume is of a softer ilk than ICE–was the sense of entitlement and strength they projected, a kind of "prove to me your worth at the gates of our great nation" vibe. America's jingoistic self-obsession is diminishing its soft power. It's now naked and vulnerable, weaker now for having obsessed over its strength for so long. Once-allies now see this. In not too long perhaps America will get everything it desires and more: it will be isolated, undesirable and unreliable as a place of work and avenue to freedom or liberation from ostensibly less developed nations.
- mdhb 2y agoI’m watching people rapidly go several standard deviations of anti Americanism here in Europe regularly the last two months. Like people are actively looking for ways to make sure the US feels the pain and consequences of their actions in little day to day ways. I’d prefer it had a lot more nuance to be honest, I don’t think it’s particularly helpful to look at this through the lens of the entire country but yeah, I’m genuinely amazed at what I’m watching, people are NOT going to forget or forgive this shit anytime soon.
- padolsey 2y agoWell, the same frailties and socio-biological forces exist on all sides of the ocean. We are all lulled into entrenchments in defensive comfort, as are Americans. Right now, America is projecting an erratic personality and a chaotic power hunger. This makes people feel fear and disgust. While it is indeed a nation of many states, and of many people of many creeds, from the outside world it operates as a singular power, all in the hands of an unpredictable egotist.
- 8note 2y agovery specifically, it encourages a "what are we gonna do next that will be banned as a war crime" questions from canadians. i think its gonna be dirty bombs. dirty bombs everywhere we can get them; just spread the Saskatchewan as far into the states as it can go. nukes are much less dangerous over the 10k year timeline vs a bunch of sask dirt. we dont need em, and maybe america will remember longer if new york is abandonned for a thousand years its not disgust, its vindictiveness
- freitasm 2y agoPure evil. People voted for evil. But tell me again how egg prices are going down.
- black_13 2y ago[dead]
- kubb 2y agoThe immigration problems in America seem very much self-inflicted. There's a lot that could be done to make it virtually impossible to live in the US illegally long term, but it's just not being done. The freak out about illegal immigrants is chronic though. It's weird, did you ever hear about any other place pulling their hair out that much over this issue?
- tomduncalf 2y agoImmigration (illegal or otherwise) was one of the big arguments that won the Brexit vote here in the UK. I guess it's an easy one to rile people up with for whatever reason.
- andybak 2y agoIt's also the topic that has the least literacy and understanding or even coherent debate. Most developed nations are going to have to choose the lesser of several "evils" very soon and there's almost no serious discussion of what the options actually are.
- idle_zealot 2y ago> did you ever hear about any other place pulling their hair out that much over this issue? Yes? Lots of right-wing parties in European countries use the same rhetoric. Xenophobia is just a manifestation of humanity's propensity for tribalism, weaponized for political support. In the US we've had one party fight to make it as hard as possible to immigrate and remain in the country legally, and another party fight back by paralyzing enforcement and deportation. The result is the insane state we're in where we have loads of illegally-present residents going about their lives and contributing to our communities and economy.
- weinzierl 2y agoGermany reporting in. Since the AFD party has fueled the debate, the other parties have outdone themselves across the board, when it comes to migration, "remigration" (which is the euphemism for deportation here) and closing the borders. Apparently we are even deporting EU citizens now. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/apr/09/germany-deport-me-eu-citizen-no-crime-standing-palestine https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2025/apr/09/german...
- ggm 2y agoDoes Amazon have a complaints and reconciliation department, and how well does it operate at returns?
- PaywallBuster 2y agothe context missing in the title: he said this at "Border Security Expo" full of private companies who could in the future have a role so of course he uses business analogies
- viraptor 2y agoI'm not sure this makes it any better. I'm not sure any context can make it better. "(...) in a room of people able to construct that system" is not really a "missing" context here.
- _def 2y agoIt's a useful context but it just shows more of the problem of how much power companies have nowadays
- oldpersonintx 2y ago[dead]
- derelicta 2y agoIf Americans don't want migrants "flooding" their country, maybe they should cease to bomb, subjugate or destabilise other nations?
- computerthings 2y ago[dead]
- CodeCrusader 2y agoIt does feel that ICE was designed to protect the country from the worst abusers of the immigration and ignored the fact that it will affect everyone else as well, going to the jail for a few weeks due to visa issues is too much.