2 ms·

If you're screwed enough you eventually just want to burn the whole thing down, whether it's rational or not, and there are definitely some people who voted tha

If you're screwed enough you eventually just want to burn the whole thing down, whether it's rational or not, and there are definitely some people who voted that way. That, or he's just a recognition of reality: resources and being a dick get you everywhere, whether it be business, politics, international relations, or the courts. Being authoritarian didn't stop China from becoming a near-parity superpower. Europeans were more than happy to start working on Nordstream 2 and attend both the World Cup and Winter Olympics in Russia long after it became apparent that Putin and his ilk were going to return to being imperialistic autocrats. Why does it matter if the US does the same if you're willing to fall in line?

Zigurd 2y ago
Most of Europe and European leaders have admitted they were wrong about Russia. Some, but not enough, Republicans know the vatniks among them are wrong.
- lenerdenator 2y ago
  They were, but they've shown that they'll gladly ignore human rights abuses and autocracy so long as the price is right. Trump's used to doing business that way, unfortunately. Really, if Putin hadn't invaded Ukraine, I don't think Europeans would particularly care about those problems in Russia. It only really became problematic when the order of the continent was threatened, and even then it took some serious arm-twisting to get certain members of NATO and the EU to commit to measures to do something.
  - Zigurd 2y ago
    Of course, relative to starting a land war in Europe "...if Putin hadn't invaded Ukraine, I don't think Europeans would particularly care..." That's proportionate. Equally, though, I'm sure they would be pleased to find Russia wanting to join a rules based order. Bolsonaro was just recently found to be plotting to kill his political rival in Brazil. What should we who are not Brazilians do about that?
    - lenerdenator 2y ago
      Depends. Are the Brazilians doing anything about it? If not, and no one else is, then there's a chance that someone like Trump might try to do something like that himself. That's what he does. He sees someone else getting away with something bad, tries to do it because he thinks he'll get an advantage, gets caught, and complains about how unfair it is that he got caught.

Zigurd 2y ago

Most of Europe and European leaders have admitted they were wrong about Russia. Some, but not enough, Republicans know the vatniks among them are wrong.

lenerdenator 2y ago
They were, but they've shown that they'll gladly ignore human rights abuses and autocracy so long as the price is right. Trump's used to doing business that way, unfortunately. Really, if Putin hadn't invaded Ukraine, I don't think Europeans would particularly care about those problems in Russia. It only really became problematic when the order of the continent was threatened, and even then it took some serious arm-twisting to get certain members of NATO and the EU to commit to measures to do something.
- Zigurd 2y ago
  Of course, relative to starting a land war in Europe "...if Putin hadn't invaded Ukraine, I don't think Europeans would particularly care..." That's proportionate. Equally, though, I'm sure they would be pleased to find Russia wanting to join a rules based order. Bolsonaro was just recently found to be plotting to kill his political rival in Brazil. What should we who are not Brazilians do about that?
  - lenerdenator 2y ago
    Depends. Are the Brazilians doing anything about it? If not, and no one else is, then there's a chance that someone like Trump might try to do something like that himself. That's what he does. He sees someone else getting away with something bad, tries to do it because he thinks he'll get an advantage, gets caught, and complains about how unfair it is that he got caught.