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by callamdelaney 2y ago

[flagged]

lostlogin 2y ago
Do you think Brexit has helped the UK?
- callamdelaney 2y ago
  I think it could have been a great help to the UK.
  - lostlogin 2y ago
    Yes, a small majority agreed. But that isn’t what I asked.
    - philjohn 2y ago
      This is the problem - brexit meant something different to everyone who voted for it ... and the reality was never going to match up because we have binding agreements like the GFA which meant Northern Ireland was always going to have to be treated differently than mainland UK.
      - gadders 2y ago
        Well, only if you think the IRA/Sinn Fein should set UK foreign policy. We could have implemented an (EU-requested) north/south border in Ireland. Or not implemented one at all.
        philjohn 2y ago
        The signatories to the GFA include the US as well - if you want to rip up the GFA to install a hard border you have to own the second order effects of that. Or decide that Brexit was never going to work the way those who peddled it said it would.
  - matt-p 2y ago
    If we'd of done what, out of interest? Personally I don't 'agree' with brexit, but it's the reality that we're in. In typical british fashion we're trying to stay friends with the EU, even though they basically hate us, while also trying to do trade with the rest of the world. Predictably we can't really do much of 2 without 1 becoming a problem (and vice versa). However 1 is currently our biggest trading partner (as a bloc, US as a country) so what have we done? Sat in the middle not doing anything radical hoping we can be best friends with everyone.
    - peterfirefly 2y ago
      We don't hate the UK. We are just waiting (impatiently) for you to come to your senses.
      - matt-p 2y ago
        So would we be able to get the exact same deal we had? We are under the impression the answer is no, as whenever we try and negotiate away stuff that's in neither of our interests it gets rejected. Take this Eitas Visa for example, this is literally just sowing resentment towards the EU in the UK. It benefits nobody and is totally insane, it's just making people hate the EU. Same with not being able to use the digital passport machines at airports.. why?? We're a pretty secure country, we have digital passports. Brexit happens and now every time I go to Europe, which is a lot I've got a 50/50 chance of waiting 3 hours at the border for someone to stamp my passport while the digital gates have no queue. That means I now have to arrive 3 hours early every time just in case. If I bring a tool for work I need to spend weeks of paperwork on something called a carnet so I end up buying there and throwing out. At the moment we're trying to give security backing for Ukraine and you're asking us to give up our fishing rights for the honour of helping secure Europe. I get it, actions have consequences, but the thing is that only a minority voted for Brexit, most of us didn't. Each year you're disenfranchising a new generation of would be Europeans with this path. To me it's all dreadfully regrettable, the whole things a mess. It's impossible for us to 'come to our senses' while we get treated like this in my view.
        2y ago
  - notatoad 2y ago
    this is not a hypothetical, brexit happened...
Symbiote 2y ago
Freedom of Expression is part of the Human Rights Act 1998. It's not the Labour party that's campaigning to repeal this act.
- callamdelaney 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - philjohn 2y ago
    Except since no parliament can bind a future parliament it won't be worth the paper it's written on. The loudest voices calling for a scrap are exactly the people you DON'T want deciding what human rights you'll be "allowed". And incitement to violence is, and always should be, unprotected speech - your silly "two tier kier" is informing me greatly that you're on the "they locked them up for hurty words!" bandwagon.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - callamdelaney 2y ago
      Weird, the bill of rights act of 1689 is still in force. It’s literally the policy of this country to sentence white men to harsher custodial sentences with more chance of a custodial sentence than any other group, simply for the crime of being a white man. Are these the sorts of people you think should decide our rights? If the government would do what people have been voting for for decades and end mass immigration and take real action on this ridiculous and purposeful misuse of the human rights act, then nobody would want to redact it. But they won’t.
      - immibis 2y ago
        [flagged]
        callamdelaney 2y ago
pjc50 2y ago
> brexit means we've halved our US tarrif rate As of time of writing this comment, I believe both are at 10%? Of course that could change at any time. > enshrine freedom of speech in law ECHR already does this. I presume there's some other weird definition of free speech going on here like unrestricted use of the N-word on TV or something.

[flagged]

lostlogin 2y ago

Do you think Brexit has helped the UK?

callamdelaney 2y ago
I think it could have been a great help to the UK.
- lostlogin 2y ago
  Yes, a small majority agreed. But that isn’t what I asked.
  - philjohn 2y ago
    This is the problem - brexit meant something different to everyone who voted for it ... and the reality was never going to match up because we have binding agreements like the GFA which meant Northern Ireland was always going to have to be treated differently than mainland UK.
    - gadders 2y ago
      Well, only if you think the IRA/Sinn Fein should set UK foreign policy. We could have implemented an (EU-requested) north/south border in Ireland. Or not implemented one at all.
      - philjohn 2y ago
        The signatories to the GFA include the US as well - if you want to rip up the GFA to install a hard border you have to own the second order effects of that. Or decide that Brexit was never going to work the way those who peddled it said it would.
- matt-p 2y ago
  If we'd of done what, out of interest? Personally I don't 'agree' with brexit, but it's the reality that we're in. In typical british fashion we're trying to stay friends with the EU, even though they basically hate us, while also trying to do trade with the rest of the world. Predictably we can't really do much of 2 without 1 becoming a problem (and vice versa). However 1 is currently our biggest trading partner (as a bloc, US as a country) so what have we done? Sat in the middle not doing anything radical hoping we can be best friends with everyone.
  - peterfirefly 2y ago
    We don't hate the UK. We are just waiting (impatiently) for you to come to your senses.
    - matt-p 2y ago
      So would we be able to get the exact same deal we had? We are under the impression the answer is no, as whenever we try and negotiate away stuff that's in neither of our interests it gets rejected. Take this Eitas Visa for example, this is literally just sowing resentment towards the EU in the UK. It benefits nobody and is totally insane, it's just making people hate the EU. Same with not being able to use the digital passport machines at airports.. why?? We're a pretty secure country, we have digital passports. Brexit happens and now every time I go to Europe, which is a lot I've got a 50/50 chance of waiting 3 hours at the border for someone to stamp my passport while the digital gates have no queue. That means I now have to arrive 3 hours early every time just in case. If I bring a tool for work I need to spend weeks of paperwork on something called a carnet so I end up buying there and throwing out. At the moment we're trying to give security backing for Ukraine and you're asking us to give up our fishing rights for the honour of helping secure Europe. I get it, actions have consequences, but the thing is that only a minority voted for Brexit, most of us didn't. Each year you're disenfranchising a new generation of would be Europeans with this path. To me it's all dreadfully regrettable, the whole things a mess. It's impossible for us to 'come to our senses' while we get treated like this in my view.
      - 2y ago
- notatoad 2y ago
  this is not a hypothetical, brexit happened...

Symbiote 2y ago

Freedom of Expression is part of the Human Rights Act 1998. It's not the Labour party that's campaigning to repeal this act.

callamdelaney 2y ago
[flagged]
- philjohn 2y ago
  Except since no parliament can bind a future parliament it won't be worth the paper it's written on. The loudest voices calling for a scrap are exactly the people you DON'T want deciding what human rights you'll be "allowed". And incitement to violence is, and always should be, unprotected speech - your silly "two tier kier" is informing me greatly that you're on the "they locked them up for hurty words!" bandwagon.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - callamdelaney 2y ago
    Weird, the bill of rights act of 1689 is still in force. It’s literally the policy of this country to sentence white men to harsher custodial sentences with more chance of a custodial sentence than any other group, simply for the crime of being a white man. Are these the sorts of people you think should decide our rights? If the government would do what people have been voting for for decades and end mass immigration and take real action on this ridiculous and purposeful misuse of the human rights act, then nobody would want to redact it. But they won’t.
    - immibis 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - callamdelaney 2y ago

pjc50 2y ago

> brexit means we've halved our US tarrif rate As of time of writing this comment, I believe both are at 10%? Of course that could change at any time. > enshrine freedom of speech in law ECHR already does this. I presume there's some other weird definition of free speech going on here like unrestricted use of the N-word on TV or something.