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I haven't done the deep dive into the details of this - it seems difficult to test at this point because everyone in the US has fluoride - but given that it re

I haven't done the deep dive into the details of this - it seems difficult to test at this point because everyone in the US has fluoride - but given that it repeatedly is raised for decades, why not have a few US states remove fluoride as a controlled test and we see what happens in a decade or two? I think that yes, more cavities but dentists can fix this, but it would be interesting to see the results on IQ, etc during that time. I think that large scale tests are the only way to move forward because it seems many groups in the US do not accept any other evidence. So let them experiment on themselves?

itishappy 2y ago
This is already happening: https://apnews.com/article/fluoride-ban-drinking-water-utah-559d92736f1958ff5d109071fa85f5b5 https://apnews.com/article/fluoride-ban-drinking-water-utah-... https://adanews.ada.org/ada-news/2025/february/utah-set-to-ban-community-water-fluoridation/ https://adanews.ada.org/ada-news/2025/february/utah-set-to-b...
John23832 2y ago
Hawaii has never had fluoride in its water (I would assume due to the close interaction between the ocean and their water supply). The study could be done. I doubt we would see a statistical difference in the IQ of Hawaiians vs everyone else.
- xhkkffbf 2y ago
  There are big racial, religious and cultural differences between Hawai'i and the mainland. I don't think anyone would be happy with any study's results.
- jljljl 2y ago
  In the latest report I can find (admittedly ~10 years old), Hawaii has some of the worst oral health and highest rates of tooth decay in the nation: https://www.civilbeat.org/2020/02/why-hawaii-continues-to-keep-fluoride-out-of-its-drinking-water/ https://www.civilbeat.org/2020/02/why-hawaii-continues-to-ke...
andrewflnr 2y ago
> but dentists can fix this I find this a laughably bad excuse. Dentist visits are expensive. A society-wide increase in dentist visits is expensive to society. The post in OP mentioned that dentist visits went up in Israel by 2x. This is not an adequate alternative option to fluoride. Edit: also, dentistry does not fully restore teeth to their pre-cavity condition anyway. It doesn't prevent all the pain. There's lots of non-monetary damage even before the dentist visits increase.
ameliaquining 2y ago
This wouldn't be informative as to the effects of fluoride, because the results would be confounded to hell and back. Just to give the most obvious example, the states that go for this are going to be the ones where the legislature is more skeptical of government interventions to improve public health, and that's going to affect outcomes in a lot of ways that have nothing to do with fluoride.

itishappy 2y ago

This is already happening: https://apnews.com/article/fluoride-ban-drinking-water-utah-559d92736f1958ff5d109071fa85f5b5 https://apnews.com/article/fluoride-ban-drinking-water-utah-... https://adanews.ada.org/ada-news/2025/february/utah-set-to-ban-community-water-fluoridation/ https://adanews.ada.org/ada-news/2025/february/utah-set-to-b...

John23832 2y ago

Hawaii has never had fluoride in its water (I would assume due to the close interaction between the ocean and their water supply). The study could be done. I doubt we would see a statistical difference in the IQ of Hawaiians vs everyone else.

xhkkffbf 2y ago
There are big racial, religious and cultural differences between Hawai'i and the mainland. I don't think anyone would be happy with any study's results.
jljljl 2y ago
In the latest report I can find (admittedly ~10 years old), Hawaii has some of the worst oral health and highest rates of tooth decay in the nation: https://www.civilbeat.org/2020/02/why-hawaii-continues-to-keep-fluoride-out-of-its-drinking-water/ https://www.civilbeat.org/2020/02/why-hawaii-continues-to-ke...

andrewflnr 2y ago

> but dentists can fix this I find this a laughably bad excuse. Dentist visits are expensive. A society-wide increase in dentist visits is expensive to society. The post in OP mentioned that dentist visits went up in Israel by 2x. This is not an adequate alternative option to fluoride. Edit: also, dentistry does not fully restore teeth to their pre-cavity condition anyway. It doesn't prevent all the pain. There's lots of non-monetary damage even before the dentist visits increase.

ameliaquining 2y ago

This wouldn't be informative as to the effects of fluoride, because the results would be confounded to hell and back. Just to give the most obvious example, the states that go for this are going to be the ones where the legislature is more skeptical of government interventions to improve public health, and that's going to affect outcomes in a lot of ways that have nothing to do with fluoride.