4 ms·

I have to tread lightly on this subject of course-- While I agree with calls for Hamas to "return the hostages," I feel exactly the same towards the thousands

by aqme28 2y ago

I have to tread lightly on this subject of course-- While I agree with calls for Hamas to "return the hostages," I feel exactly the same towards the thousands of Palestinians kept in Israeli prisons, often innocent, often without charge, often underage, often beaten, tortured, or sexually abused.

mvdtnz 2y ago
Got any evidence for any of these allegations?
- moshin 2y ago
  have you got any evidence to the contrary?
- jhanschoo 2y ago
  I'm not parent commenter, but TFA is primary reporting containing exactly the evidence you are asking about. > men [...] held under Israel's Unlawful Combatants Law, a measure by which people suspected of posing a security risk can be detained for an unspecified period without charge, as Israel set out to recover the hostages and dismantle the proscribed terror group which may or may not be distinct what parent comment refers to by Palestinian prisoners: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn7vje365rno https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn7vje365rno The BBC article cites further related reporting: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2yylgze4ro https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2yylgze4ro https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/documents/hrbodies/hrcouncil/sessions-regular/session58/a-hrc-58-crp-6.pdf https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/documents/hrbodies...
- geenkeuse 2y ago
  [dead]
yieldcrv 2y ago
There are large protests of the fragile Israeli coalition government, by Jewish Israeli citizens, in Israel, every day. Specifically over this unpopular war. They flared up in size after the most recent cease fire ended. It means that the global unpopularity of this war by non-Jewish non-Israeli people was always worth validating. The culture of deflection in response to non-jewish people criticizing the exact same things that Jewish Israeli citizens are is just a meme worth ignoring. The general idea is that there is a belief that non-jewish people worldwide are thinly hiding a goal of eradication. A lot of Jewish and Israeli people are taught that from a young age, so its not easy for them to tell when people are only criticizing the exact same government policies that they are, with the same level of nuance.
- BenGosub 2y ago
  It's a genocide it's not a war
- unruffled4079 2y ago
  Would you be able to explain how > A lot of Jewish and Israeli people are taught [that non-jewish people worldwide are thinly hiding a goal of eradication] from a young age this works? I'm not Jewish or Israeli, and would like to understand whether it's taught through religion or culture. And what "eradication" means in this context.
  - jfengel 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - geenkeuse 2y ago
      "Even before the Holocaust, there was plenty of support for that: the Inquisition, pogroms, the Ghetto, expulsion from various countries throughout the Middle Ages." And yet who were the ones to give yo refuge from the horrors caused by Europeans? Those very same Palestinians which you so despise Evil is evil. no amount of propaganda can wash off that stink. How far have you fallen, from being the victim to the attacker. Yet you still care to remind us all of how your people suffered. And then you go ahead and murder more innocents. Evil. No other word can suffice. <Shadowbanned - No surprise :-)>
  - yieldcrv 2y ago
    There is a supporting history. Over the last millennium, Jewish people’s presence has aggravated their host country or they’ve been scapegoated many times. Resulting in a need for their swift exodus. It is very recent that the West was favorable to Jewish people at all, on a country by country basis. With the most inroads occurring after some sects of Christianity latched on to the recreation of Israel as being part of their own prophecy. So there is an understanding that even this is thin acceptance and symbiotic where both groups are pawns to the other without much care for understanding each other. But there are people that question the government policies of Israel without questioning its right to be a government at all. I can see why it’s ambiguous to distinguish, and the best defense is to invalidate opinion. Its just disingenuous when the stated opinions they are invalidating are the same opinions they and others hold within Israel and some Jewish communities: The military campaign is unpopular. The coalition government has no coherent way to meet its goals. Every choice the IDF makes isn’t “Hamas’ fault”.

by aqme28 2y ago

mvdtnz 2y ago

Got any evidence for any of these allegations?

moshin 2y ago
have you got any evidence to the contrary?
jhanschoo 2y ago
I'm not parent commenter, but TFA is primary reporting containing exactly the evidence you are asking about. > men [...] held under Israel's Unlawful Combatants Law, a measure by which people suspected of posing a security risk can be detained for an unspecified period without charge, as Israel set out to recover the hostages and dismantle the proscribed terror group which may or may not be distinct what parent comment refers to by Palestinian prisoners: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn7vje365rno https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn7vje365rno The BBC article cites further related reporting: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2yylgze4ro https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cx2yylgze4ro https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/documents/hrbodies/hrcouncil/sessions-regular/session58/a-hrc-58-crp-6.pdf https://www.ohchr.org/sites/default/files/documents/hrbodies...
geenkeuse 2y ago
[dead]

yieldcrv 2y ago

There are large protests of the fragile Israeli coalition government, by Jewish Israeli citizens, in Israel, every day. Specifically over this unpopular war. They flared up in size after the most recent cease fire ended. It means that the global unpopularity of this war by non-Jewish non-Israeli people was always worth validating. The culture of deflection in response to non-jewish people criticizing the exact same things that Jewish Israeli citizens are is just a meme worth ignoring. The general idea is that there is a belief that non-jewish people worldwide are thinly hiding a goal of eradication. A lot of Jewish and Israeli people are taught that from a young age, so its not easy for them to tell when people are only criticizing the exact same government policies that they are, with the same level of nuance.

BenGosub 2y ago
It's a genocide it's not a war
unruffled4079 2y ago
Would you be able to explain how > A lot of Jewish and Israeli people are taught [that non-jewish people worldwide are thinly hiding a goal of eradication] from a young age this works? I'm not Jewish or Israeli, and would like to understand whether it's taught through religion or culture. And what "eradication" means in this context.
- jfengel 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - geenkeuse 2y ago
    "Even before the Holocaust, there was plenty of support for that: the Inquisition, pogroms, the Ghetto, expulsion from various countries throughout the Middle Ages." And yet who were the ones to give yo refuge from the horrors caused by Europeans? Those very same Palestinians which you so despise Evil is evil. no amount of propaganda can wash off that stink. How far have you fallen, from being the victim to the attacker. Yet you still care to remind us all of how your people suffered. And then you go ahead and murder more innocents. Evil. No other word can suffice. <Shadowbanned - No surprise :-)>
- yieldcrv 2y ago
  There is a supporting history. Over the last millennium, Jewish people’s presence has aggravated their host country or they’ve been scapegoated many times. Resulting in a need for their swift exodus. It is very recent that the West was favorable to Jewish people at all, on a country by country basis. With the most inroads occurring after some sects of Christianity latched on to the recreation of Israel as being part of their own prophecy. So there is an understanding that even this is thin acceptance and symbiotic where both groups are pawns to the other without much care for understanding each other. But there are people that question the government policies of Israel without questioning its right to be a government at all. I can see why it’s ambiguous to distinguish, and the best defense is to invalidate opinion. Its just disingenuous when the stated opinions they are invalidating are the same opinions they and others hold within Israel and some Jewish communities: The military campaign is unpopular. The coalition government has no coherent way to meet its goals. Every choice the IDF makes isn’t “Hamas’ fault”.