24 ms·

The big news on EV charging is from BYD in late March when they announced (and it caused TSLA to fall by a few percent) that their new line of superchargers wil

The big news on EV charging is from BYD in late March when they announced (and it caused TSLA to fall by a few percent) that their new line of superchargers will be able to charge cars to give them a range of 400 km in just a few minutes. This is the state of the art in production https://www.ttnews.com/articles/byd-5-minute-charging-rivals https://www.ttnews.com/articles/byd-5-minute-charging-rivals

indemnity 1y ago
I mean, this is great, but BYD has pretty much zero installed charger footprint in markets where the Supercharger network exists. Is that going to change?
- Peanuts99 1y ago
  Isn't their plan to sell them to charger operators?
  - notahacker 1y ago
    Yeah, would have thought if BYD played it smartly and the tech is that far ahead, they could get a lot of market share from batteries and chargers even if Europe's car brands remain strong and protected.
- ffsm8 1y ago
  Considering current politics: not in the US, at least not for the foreseeable future. Europe remains to be seen, but also unlikely short term as we're also slapping lots of tariffs on chinese EVs to protect local industries
  - LoganDark 1y ago
    Countries really need to stop unfairly penalizing Chinese EVs. If they aren't allowed to compete, local industries will never have an incentive to improve. No argument about safety has ever had any merit - Teslas burst into flames all the time.
    - mschuster91 1y ago
      > If they aren't allowed to compete, local industries will never have an incentive to improve. Neither Europe nor the US can compete with the level of disdain for the environment, labor laws and poverty that China brings to the table. Wages alone make anything made in China so cheap that, for mass-market goods, competing against China (or its upcoming competitors in the race to the bottom) is impossible.
      - LoganDark 1y ago
        So what if someone living on Chinese wages wouldn't be able to afford American goods? The equivalent Chinese goods are perfectly affordable for them. You seemingly forget that China is a self-sufficient economy. It's not like people are working 16 hours a day to afford an apartment like in the US. Apartments in China can be as low as USD $400 a month or less. Try running your wage and poverty calculations with that?
      - FirmwareBurner 1y ago
        >Neither Europe nor the US can compete with the level of disdain for the environment, labor laws and poverty that China brings to the table Why haven't western governments and companies brought this up as an issue when they moved our jobs to China 30 years ago forcing us to buy our stuff but made in China while their profits skyrocketed? And bear in mind Chinese pollution, wages and living standards were way worse back then than today. It feels incredibly hypocritical for western companies to cry about these things NOW, right when the Chinese companies have started eating their lunch on their home turf, while they rode the gravy train for 30 years. It's almost as if they wanted to have their cake and eat it too but now have to reap what they sow and they don't like it.
        hulitu 1y ago
        > It's almost as if they have to reap what they sow and they don't like it. They do reap what they sow. The automotive industry is a victim of its own stupidity. They lobbied for features until the cars became so expensive that nobody buys them.
- bgnn 1y ago
  They are expanding in Europe rapidly, and in China of course. In the Netherlands they are partnered with a local green electricity provider (Vattenfall) and Shel for their charger network. Shell owns the most petrol stations along the highways, so they will have their chargers there for sure. I'm expecting the tariffs on Chinese EVs to be rolled back in EU after the US tariffs. They might want BYD to open local factories, like NIO is planning to do.
  - 3D30497420 1y ago
    > I'm expecting the tariffs on Chinese EVs to be rolled back in EU after the US tariffs. I doubt it. This would likely have a significant negative impact on domestic EU car companies, most of which are considered cornerstones of their local country's economy. Now, whether this should happen (to benefit consumers/the environment) is another argument.
    - InDubioProRubio 1y ago
      Then again, the most protective germany, has manoveured itself into a corner, with its production proxxy ungary loosing the "in-between-empires" heat gradient and annoying everyone.
    - tonfa 1y ago
      > I doubt it. This would likely have a significant negative impact on domestic EU car companies They want to pair that with technology transfers, similar to how China forced other companies to do technology transfers when opening factories.
timerol 1y ago
The state of the art (not just for BYD) is to make sure you don't have to charge a cold battery by getting it to the right temperature before charging. One of the reasons that Tesla (and others) has navigation integrated into trip planning integrated into the vehicle is so that the battery temperature can be optimized in the 10 minutes before you start charging, to maximize charging speed. BYD would not pump 400 kW into a battery at -10 C. This research helps in the situation where you have a cold battery, and need to start charging it before it can warm up.
bufferoverflow 1y ago
That requires 1 megawatt chargers. For each charger. Not saying it's impossible, but that won't be easy.
- michaelt 1y ago
  The US consumes 376 million gallons of gas per day. Which is equivalent to a continuous power draw of 500 gigawatts. Megawatt chargers? We'll need the generation capacity to support 500,000 of them.
  - bufferoverflow 1y ago
    What does whole country consumption have to do with building megawatt chargers? The problem isn't trivial. If you have, say, 10 charging spots on a lot, each requiring a megawatt, how are you going to deliver that? Are you going to build a whole substation for every charging parking lot?

indemnity 1y ago

I mean, this is great, but BYD has pretty much zero installed charger footprint in markets where the Supercharger network exists. Is that going to change?

Peanuts99 1y ago
Isn't their plan to sell them to charger operators?
- notahacker 1y ago
  Yeah, would have thought if BYD played it smartly and the tech is that far ahead, they could get a lot of market share from batteries and chargers even if Europe's car brands remain strong and protected.
ffsm8 1y ago
Considering current politics: not in the US, at least not for the foreseeable future. Europe remains to be seen, but also unlikely short term as we're also slapping lots of tariffs on chinese EVs to protect local industries
- LoganDark 1y ago
  Countries really need to stop unfairly penalizing Chinese EVs. If they aren't allowed to compete, local industries will never have an incentive to improve. No argument about safety has ever had any merit - Teslas burst into flames all the time.
  - mschuster91 1y ago
    > If they aren't allowed to compete, local industries will never have an incentive to improve. Neither Europe nor the US can compete with the level of disdain for the environment, labor laws and poverty that China brings to the table. Wages alone make anything made in China so cheap that, for mass-market goods, competing against China (or its upcoming competitors in the race to the bottom) is impossible.
    - LoganDark 1y ago
      So what if someone living on Chinese wages wouldn't be able to afford American goods? The equivalent Chinese goods are perfectly affordable for them. You seemingly forget that China is a self-sufficient economy. It's not like people are working 16 hours a day to afford an apartment like in the US. Apartments in China can be as low as USD $400 a month or less. Try running your wage and poverty calculations with that?
    - FirmwareBurner 1y ago
      >Neither Europe nor the US can compete with the level of disdain for the environment, labor laws and poverty that China brings to the table Why haven't western governments and companies brought this up as an issue when they moved our jobs to China 30 years ago forcing us to buy our stuff but made in China while their profits skyrocketed? And bear in mind Chinese pollution, wages and living standards were way worse back then than today. It feels incredibly hypocritical for western companies to cry about these things NOW, right when the Chinese companies have started eating their lunch on their home turf, while they rode the gravy train for 30 years. It's almost as if they wanted to have their cake and eat it too but now have to reap what they sow and they don't like it.
      - hulitu 1y ago
        > It's almost as if they have to reap what they sow and they don't like it. They do reap what they sow. The automotive industry is a victim of its own stupidity. They lobbied for features until the cars became so expensive that nobody buys them.
bgnn 1y ago
They are expanding in Europe rapidly, and in China of course. In the Netherlands they are partnered with a local green electricity provider (Vattenfall) and Shel for their charger network. Shell owns the most petrol stations along the highways, so they will have their chargers there for sure. I'm expecting the tariffs on Chinese EVs to be rolled back in EU after the US tariffs. They might want BYD to open local factories, like NIO is planning to do.
- 3D30497420 1y ago
  > I'm expecting the tariffs on Chinese EVs to be rolled back in EU after the US tariffs. I doubt it. This would likely have a significant negative impact on domestic EU car companies, most of which are considered cornerstones of their local country's economy. Now, whether this should happen (to benefit consumers/the environment) is another argument.
  - InDubioProRubio 1y ago
    Then again, the most protective germany, has manoveured itself into a corner, with its production proxxy ungary loosing the "in-between-empires" heat gradient and annoying everyone.
  - tonfa 1y ago
    > I doubt it. This would likely have a significant negative impact on domestic EU car companies They want to pair that with technology transfers, similar to how China forced other companies to do technology transfers when opening factories.

timerol 1y ago

The state of the art (not just for BYD) is to make sure you don't have to charge a cold battery by getting it to the right temperature before charging. One of the reasons that Tesla (and others) has navigation integrated into trip planning integrated into the vehicle is so that the battery temperature can be optimized in the 10 minutes before you start charging, to maximize charging speed. BYD would not pump 400 kW into a battery at -10 C. This research helps in the situation where you have a cold battery, and need to start charging it before it can warm up.

bufferoverflow 1y ago

That requires 1 megawatt chargers. For each charger. Not saying it's impossible, but that won't be easy.

michaelt 1y ago
The US consumes 376 million gallons of gas per day. Which is equivalent to a continuous power draw of 500 gigawatts. Megawatt chargers? We'll need the generation capacity to support 500,000 of them.
- bufferoverflow 1y ago
  What does whole country consumption have to do with building megawatt chargers? The problem isn't trivial. If you have, say, 10 charging spots on a lot, each requiring a megawatt, how are you going to deliver that? Are you going to build a whole substation for every charging parking lot?