3 ms·

I was a British tourist trying to leave America. Then I was detained, shackled

32 points by nickcotter 2y ago

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
blacksqr 2y ago
I don't understand the point of this article. Was she not working in the US in exchange for accommodation? It certainly seems she was. Was she not violating US visa rules by doing so? IANAL but it seems plausible she was. Why did she sign her statement if it was inaccurate? I seem to see a lot of stories of people getting in legal trouble that boil down to 'I signed an inaccurate statement because I thought that would make it all go away.' Is this supposed to be an argument worthy of sympathy? Is there a reason to see this story as something other than someone was unable to exercise white privilege to avoid consequences for bending (breaking) the rules?
- xiphias2 2y ago
  All you are writing is true, but I would still put the main responsibility to workaway. Writing that ,,you need to obtain the correct visa'' is just not enough for a big company thats main profile is arranging work.
- mcphage 2y ago
  > I don't understand the point of this article. The point of the article is to warn potential tourists to stay away from the US because it is no longer safe.
  - ziml77 2y ago
    But for this specific case, would it have been any different a year ago? She was working in the US without a work visa. The US should have caught this before she came in here but didn't. Canada however raised an eyebrow at the arrangement and turned her away, while also informing the US officers as to why. They then realized she was doing the same thing in the US and so documented it and detained her for illegally working in the US. What else could the response to the situation have been here? Because saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I didn't realize I got the wrong visa" is like saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I thought that sign said speed limit 80 MPH, not speed limit 30 MPH".
    - mcphage 2y ago
      > But for this specific case, would it have been any different a year ago? Yes? They may have kicked her out of the country—not locked her up for 19 days. > Because saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I didn't realize I got the wrong visa" is like saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I thought that sign said speed limit 80 MPH, not speed limit 30 MPH". And if someone said that, do you think they should get locked up for 19 days?
    - 5555624 2y ago
      >The US should have caught this before she came in here but didn't. How? Unless she said, on her (tourist) visa application or when she actually entered the country, that she wqas going to be working, they wouldn't know. Years ago, my ex-wife came to he U.S. on a tourist visa specifically to work as an au pair. The agency she worked with and the family she worked for, all told her just to say she was coming here on vacation. No one at (then) INS ever knew. (When we decided to get married, she went home and we went through the seris K visa process.)
  - 5555624 2y ago
    Warn people coming to the US on a tourist visa not to work while they are here. Sure, people do it and people get away with it; but, if you get caught -- especially now -- you're going to run into trouble.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
- Nextgrid 2y ago
  > Why did she sign her statement if it was inaccurate? Easy to say this in the comfort of your home while having all the time in the world to think about it. Much less so in a stressful situation and under pressure.
  - blacksqr 2y ago
    Also easier to research the applicable laws in the comfort of your home before you leave instead of trying to triangulate the situation while in detention. According to the article the Workaway website explicitly says the traveler is responsible for securing the proper visas, which the woman here clearly did not do. IANAL but I know enough about US law to know that giving accommodation is explicitly barred from being counted as compensation. Workers have to be paid minimum wage regardless of any room or board provided. I would be surprised if the law was much different in the UK.
- owebmaster 2y ago
  equate volunteering to work will do wonders to the US tourism. Backpackers are tourists, not workers.
- librasteve 2y ago
  the point of this article is to whip up even more dislike of the US and of travelling to the US among brits (who were already quite chippy about our richer and more handsome cousins across the pond) that sells lefty newspapers like the guardian it’s kind of all we can do to rail against your newly chosen president and his entourage who seem hell bent on screwing us all over i feel sorry for, and i continue to like my american friends who did not vote for this betrayal of all values and relationships - but tbh there is a big backlash in popularity going on right now and i’m in the minority
xiphias2 2y ago
,,Some hosts may give a paid allowance to ensure they are offering at least the minimum wage in their country'' It's sad, but workaway is similarly to airbnb (hotel service) and uber (taxi service) uses ,,work'' and ,,help'' interchangebly on its website on purpose. I am a tourist in USA (not working), and I haven't experienced any problem at the border control.
- drukenemo 2y ago
  Me neither, but the media is in a frenzy to scrutinize Trump. He certainly gives them lots of reason to do so, but I doubt those type of actions as response to visa violations didn’t occur before.
  - Arnt 2y ago
    Locking up Mexicans, Indonesians for days? Not new at all. Harassing anyone and everyone, sure. A then-former prime minister of Norway was harassed at the US border, they kept him for hours. But 19 days when you have a rich-country passport and pale white skin is off the former scale. It's weird.
docdeek 2y ago
> Had she been paid? Was there a contract? Would she have lost her accommodation if she could no longer provide services? Becky answered no to everything. She was a tourist, she said. Isn't the point of the 'free' accommodation via Workaway that you o my get to stay for free for doing some work/cleaning/service? If you turned up and didn't fulfill your side of the Workaway deal surely you would lose your accommodation. Certainly no fun to be treated this way however Canadian authorities also told her she needed a working visa to Workaway in that country. It seems that the reason she ever came into contact with the US authorities is that she did not apply for the correct visa for either Canada or the US in the first place.

32 points by nickcotter 2y ago

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

I don't understand the point of this article. Was she not working in the US in exchange for accommodation? It certainly seems she was. Was she not violating US visa rules by doing so? IANAL but it seems plausible she was. Why did she sign her statement if it was inaccurate? I seem to see a lot of stories of people getting in legal trouble that boil down to 'I signed an inaccurate statement because I thought that would make it all go away.' Is this supposed to be an argument worthy of sympathy? Is there a reason to see this story as something other than someone was unable to exercise white privilege to avoid consequences for bending (breaking) the rules?

xiphias2 2y ago
All you are writing is true, but I would still put the main responsibility to workaway. Writing that ,,you need to obtain the correct visa'' is just not enough for a big company thats main profile is arranging work.
mcphage 2y ago
> I don't understand the point of this article. The point of the article is to warn potential tourists to stay away from the US because it is no longer safe.
- ziml77 2y ago
  But for this specific case, would it have been any different a year ago? She was working in the US without a work visa. The US should have caught this before she came in here but didn't. Canada however raised an eyebrow at the arrangement and turned her away, while also informing the US officers as to why. They then realized she was doing the same thing in the US and so documented it and detained her for illegally working in the US. What else could the response to the situation have been here? Because saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I didn't realize I got the wrong visa" is like saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I thought that sign said speed limit 80 MPH, not speed limit 30 MPH".
  - mcphage 2y ago
    > But for this specific case, would it have been any different a year ago? Yes? They may have kicked her out of the country—not locked her up for 19 days. > Because saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I didn't realize I got the wrong visa" is like saying "oh it was all just a mistake, I thought that sign said speed limit 80 MPH, not speed limit 30 MPH". And if someone said that, do you think they should get locked up for 19 days?
  - 5555624 2y ago
    >The US should have caught this before she came in here but didn't. How? Unless she said, on her (tourist) visa application or when she actually entered the country, that she wqas going to be working, they wouldn't know. Years ago, my ex-wife came to he U.S. on a tourist visa specifically to work as an au pair. The agency she worked with and the family she worked for, all told her just to say she was coming here on vacation. No one at (then) INS ever knew. (When we decided to get married, she went home and we went through the seris K visa process.)
- 5555624 2y ago
  Warn people coming to the US on a tourist visa not to work while they are here. Sure, people do it and people get away with it; but, if you get caught -- especially now -- you're going to run into trouble.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
Nextgrid 2y ago
> Why did she sign her statement if it was inaccurate? Easy to say this in the comfort of your home while having all the time in the world to think about it. Much less so in a stressful situation and under pressure.
- blacksqr 2y ago
  Also easier to research the applicable laws in the comfort of your home before you leave instead of trying to triangulate the situation while in detention. According to the article the Workaway website explicitly says the traveler is responsible for securing the proper visas, which the woman here clearly did not do. IANAL but I know enough about US law to know that giving accommodation is explicitly barred from being counted as compensation. Workers have to be paid minimum wage regardless of any room or board provided. I would be surprised if the law was much different in the UK.
owebmaster 2y ago
equate volunteering to work will do wonders to the US tourism. Backpackers are tourists, not workers.
librasteve 2y ago
the point of this article is to whip up even more dislike of the US and of travelling to the US among brits (who were already quite chippy about our richer and more handsome cousins across the pond) that sells lefty newspapers like the guardian it’s kind of all we can do to rail against your newly chosen president and his entourage who seem hell bent on screwing us all over i feel sorry for, and i continue to like my american friends who did not vote for this betrayal of all values and relationships - but tbh there is a big backlash in popularity going on right now and i’m in the minority

xiphias2 2y ago

,,Some hosts may give a paid allowance to ensure they are offering at least the minimum wage in their country'' It's sad, but workaway is similarly to airbnb (hotel service) and uber (taxi service) uses ,,work'' and ,,help'' interchangebly on its website on purpose. I am a tourist in USA (not working), and I haven't experienced any problem at the border control.

drukenemo 2y ago
Me neither, but the media is in a frenzy to scrutinize Trump. He certainly gives them lots of reason to do so, but I doubt those type of actions as response to visa violations didn’t occur before.
- Arnt 2y ago
  Locking up Mexicans, Indonesians for days? Not new at all. Harassing anyone and everyone, sure. A then-former prime minister of Norway was harassed at the US border, they kept him for hours. But 19 days when you have a rich-country passport and pale white skin is off the former scale. It's weird.

docdeek 2y ago

> Had she been paid? Was there a contract? Would she have lost her accommodation if she could no longer provide services? Becky answered no to everything. She was a tourist, she said. Isn't the point of the 'free' accommodation via Workaway that you o my get to stay for free for doing some work/cleaning/service? If you turned up and didn't fulfill your side of the Workaway deal surely you would lose your accommodation. Certainly no fun to be treated this way however Canadian authorities also told her she needed a working visa to Workaway in that country. It seems that the reason she ever came into contact with the US authorities is that she did not apply for the correct visa for either Canada or the US in the first place.