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> The things that dominate middle class budgets: food [...] have become increasingly unaffordable in recent decades I tried finding some number to corroborate

by IMTDb 2y ago

> The things that dominate middle class budgets: food [...] have become increasingly unaffordable in recent decades I tried finding some number to corroborate your claims. The proportion of food in the American budget has decreased from ~17% to ~13% between the 60's and now. In fact, it has decreased a lot for "at home food" and increased slightly for "dining out food"[1]. Food seems cheaper than ever - on average. The current price of a calorie sufficient diet is now roughly $0.44/day in the US [2] that sounds very low. Between the 60's and today; the average daily supply of calories per person has increased from ~3000 kcal to ~3800 kcal [3]. People eat more than ever - on average. [1] https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/chart-detail?chartId=76967 https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/chart-d... [2] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cost-calorie-sufficient-diet?tab=chart https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/cost-calorie-sufficient-d... [3] https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/daily-per-capita-caloric-supply?time=1965..latest&country=GBR~USA https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/daily-per-capita-caloric-... I really wanna believe you, but aren't you just looking at the past with rose tainted glasses. And if you are young; aren't you making up a past that doesn't even exist ?

romaaeterna 2y ago
Over the period since the 1960s, look at education, medicine, housing, not food. For food prices, look at the most recent 5-year timescale, where price increases are reported to be on the order of 30% for American consumers. [1] [1] https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/price-of-food https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/price-of-food
- IMTDb 2y ago
  Yes, that's how proportion works; if thighs like food take a smaller portion of spending, some other things will take a bigger share. GP comment is cited food as the first item; and decades (not 5 year) as the reference timeframe, so I focused on that. I am sure that by cherry picking both items and timeframe (look at food but only over 5 year; education but only since the 60's; telecommunication but only since the price hike of last week) you can paint a different story, but that's not the point here.
  - romaaeterna 2y ago
    The average inflation-adjusted annual tuition for a 4-year degree has gone from $2843 to $10,892 between 1969 and 2023 in 2023-dollars. [1] Healthcare spending per capita has gone from $2,151 to $14,570 in the same period in 2023-dollars. [2] The inflation-adjusted home price index has more than doubled over that period. [3] Real wages have remained fairly stagnant over these same decades. [4] [1] https://educationdata.org/average-cost-of-college-by-year https://educationdata.org/average-cost-of-college-by-year [2] https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/u-s-spending-healthcare-changed-time/ https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/u-s-spe... [3] https://cdn-0.inflationdata.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/Inflation-Adjusted-Home-Prices.png https://cdn-0.inflationdata.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/... [4] https://www.epi.org/publication/charting-wage-stagnation/ https://www.epi.org/publication/charting-wage-stagnation/
    - IMTDb 2y ago
      At least for eduction this increase can be explained by the simple supply and demand; Americans on average have never been as educated as today. The demand for college degrees and above has skyrocketed; according to the same source as you use [1]. Stuff costs less, so more people put their children through college, so education price goes up; it's the symptom of a good thing. [1] https://educationdata.org/college-enrollment-statistics https://educationdata.org/college-enrollment-statistics

by IMTDb 2y ago

romaaeterna 2y ago

Over the period since the 1960s, look at education, medicine, housing, not food. For food prices, look at the most recent 5-year timescale, where price increases are reported to be on the order of 30% for American consumers. [1] [1] https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/price-of-food https://www.nerdwallet.com/article/finance/price-of-food

IMTDb 2y ago
Yes, that's how proportion works; if thighs like food take a smaller portion of spending, some other things will take a bigger share. GP comment is cited food as the first item; and decades (not 5 year) as the reference timeframe, so I focused on that. I am sure that by cherry picking both items and timeframe (look at food but only over 5 year; education but only since the 60's; telecommunication but only since the price hike of last week) you can paint a different story, but that's not the point here.
- romaaeterna 2y ago
  The average inflation-adjusted annual tuition for a 4-year degree has gone from $2843 to $10,892 between 1969 and 2023 in 2023-dollars. [1] Healthcare spending per capita has gone from $2,151 to $14,570 in the same period in 2023-dollars. [2] The inflation-adjusted home price index has more than doubled over that period. [3] Real wages have remained fairly stagnant over these same decades. [4] [1] https://educationdata.org/average-cost-of-college-by-year https://educationdata.org/average-cost-of-college-by-year [2] https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/u-s-spending-healthcare-changed-time/ https://www.healthsystemtracker.org/chart-collection/u-s-spe... [3] https://cdn-0.inflationdata.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/Inflation-Adjusted-Home-Prices.png https://cdn-0.inflationdata.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/... [4] https://www.epi.org/publication/charting-wage-stagnation/ https://www.epi.org/publication/charting-wage-stagnation/
  - IMTDb 2y ago
    At least for eduction this increase can be explained by the simple supply and demand; Americans on average have never been as educated as today. The demand for college degrees and above has skyrocketed; according to the same source as you use [1]. Stuff costs less, so more people put their children through college, so education price goes up; it's the symptom of a good thing. [1] https://educationdata.org/college-enrollment-statistics https://educationdata.org/college-enrollment-statistics