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> empathy isn't useful to society ... Having empathy will actively hurt your own life Even if I accepted the second statement (which to be clear, I absolutely

> empathy isn't useful to society ... Having empathy will actively hurt your own life Even if I accepted the second statement (which to be clear, I absolutely do not), it doesn't follow that empathy isn't useful to society. Society is not benefited by everyone running about chasing their own personal success to the exclusion of all others: that kind of world isn't even called a society. We have other names for that and they're less positive.

zwnow 2y ago
I am aware people have trouble building this mental model of an unempathetic society. I am old enough to have witnessed that in 99% of situations people are directly responsible for their own situation. There is no reason to have empathy.
- lolinder 2y ago
  > building this mental model of an unempathetic society No, it's not about mental models, it's that what you're describing is, at the limit, no longer a society at all. You need a different word for the kind of Randian endgame you're advocating for. Using "society" for it is just confusing things for everyone involved.
- TheOtherHobbes 2y ago
  You think that's what you've witnessed, but perhaps you're confirming a distorted prejudice and not a reality - because that's exactly what someone who lacks empathy would see. People who can't see green are evidence of a genetic defect, not evidence that green doesn't exist.
- bumby 2y ago
  >99% of situations people are directly responsible for their own situation. This seems to be a flawed mental model in itself. At the very least, you should elaborate on your definition of empathy. Do you think cognitive empathy is bad? If so, you’re ignoring that social interactions impact outcomes.
- InsideOutSanta 2y ago
  >I am old enough to have witnessed that in 99% of situations people are directly responsible for their own situation Old people can be wrong, and in this case, they are. >There is no reason to have empathy. This is a category mistake. You reason that empathy is superfluous if people are the cause of their misfortune. However, whether people are the cause of their misfortunes is utterly irrelevant to whether there is a reason to have empathy. So far, none of your arguments have had any discernible logic behind them. If you are so convinced that empathy is needless, why can you not articulate a coherent argument for your position?
  - zwnow 2y ago
    You not seeing arguments doesn't invalidate them. You arent the judge on this.
    - InsideOutSanta 2y ago
      Do you think this response will convince anyone that you are correct? You still fail to provide an argument; you're just being unpleasant. To what end? Is that what not having empathy in a society feels like? People just talking at each other without any particular goal in mind other than being unpleasant to each other?
      - mdp2021 2y ago
        > will convince anyone Are you sure that would be the poster's attempt. > you're just being He seems to be discussing, to some of us.
        InsideOutSanta 2y ago
        >Are you sure that would be the poster's attempt. What do you suspect he is attempting to do?
        mdp2021 2y ago
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- snozolli 2y ago
  "My confirmation bias has proven me right 99% of the time!"
- buttercraft 2y ago
  > mental model of an unempathetic society You mean, like, a pack of wild dogs?

zwnow 2y ago

I am aware people have trouble building this mental model of an unempathetic society. I am old enough to have witnessed that in 99% of situations people are directly responsible for their own situation. There is no reason to have empathy.

lolinder 2y ago
> building this mental model of an unempathetic society No, it's not about mental models, it's that what you're describing is, at the limit, no longer a society at all. You need a different word for the kind of Randian endgame you're advocating for. Using "society" for it is just confusing things for everyone involved.
TheOtherHobbes 2y ago
You think that's what you've witnessed, but perhaps you're confirming a distorted prejudice and not a reality - because that's exactly what someone who lacks empathy would see. People who can't see green are evidence of a genetic defect, not evidence that green doesn't exist.
bumby 2y ago
>99% of situations people are directly responsible for their own situation. This seems to be a flawed mental model in itself. At the very least, you should elaborate on your definition of empathy. Do you think cognitive empathy is bad? If so, you’re ignoring that social interactions impact outcomes.
InsideOutSanta 2y ago
>I am old enough to have witnessed that in 99% of situations people are directly responsible for their own situation Old people can be wrong, and in this case, they are. >There is no reason to have empathy. This is a category mistake. You reason that empathy is superfluous if people are the cause of their misfortune. However, whether people are the cause of their misfortunes is utterly irrelevant to whether there is a reason to have empathy. So far, none of your arguments have had any discernible logic behind them. If you are so convinced that empathy is needless, why can you not articulate a coherent argument for your position?
- zwnow 2y ago
  You not seeing arguments doesn't invalidate them. You arent the judge on this.
  - InsideOutSanta 2y ago
    Do you think this response will convince anyone that you are correct? You still fail to provide an argument; you're just being unpleasant. To what end? Is that what not having empathy in a society feels like? People just talking at each other without any particular goal in mind other than being unpleasant to each other?
    - mdp2021 2y ago
      > will convince anyone Are you sure that would be the poster's attempt. > you're just being He seems to be discussing, to some of us.
      - InsideOutSanta 2y ago
        >Are you sure that would be the poster's attempt. What do you suspect he is attempting to do?
        mdp2021 2y ago
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
snozolli 2y ago
"My confirmation bias has proven me right 99% of the time!"
buttercraft 2y ago
> mental model of an unempathetic society You mean, like, a pack of wild dogs?