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I might be missing the point of the author, but what's the difference between Steam Deck and a normal Windows gaming laptop in terms of software freedom? Would

I might be missing the point of the author, but what's the difference between Steam Deck and a normal Windows gaming laptop in terms of software freedom? Wouldn't you have more software freedom on Windows? Because you can run both Windows and Linux software (via WSL2). I use macOS, Windows and Linux daily. They are all pretty open to installing and running your own software. And all of them have some sort of security measures that prevent you from running arbitrary apps unless you close some scary warnings or bypass it with some flags.

TehCorwiz 2y ago
I think you're misunderstanding the meaning of "Software freedom". It refers more to the process and transparency of the software than to the choice. That said, the Steam Deck is just a handheld PC. And Valve gives instructions on how to install Windows on it should you want to do that. https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/6121-ECCD-D643-BAA8 https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/6121-ECCD-D643-BA... Often we talk about software freedom in the context of open-source development and free-software licenses like the GPL. The Free Software Foundation stated as a bootstrapping organization to write open source software for the GNU platform (Linux/Unix standard userspace environment). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Software_Foundation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Software_Foundation Valve is pretty well respected from that perspective. SteamOS is built on Arch Linux. They publish the source for most of their Linux tools https://github.com/ValveSoftware/ https://github.com/ValveSoftware/. The development of Proton, their in-house compatibility layer that uses Wine under the hood, is also open source and developed with community involvement. Single hardware platform makes it easier to handle the morass of driver development. They upstream their changes to other projects. There are actually open source forks of things like Proton (https://github.com/GloriousEggroll/proton-ge-custom https://github.com/GloriousEggroll/proton-ge-custom is a popular one).
- jerf 2y ago
  I'd also call out that Valve is probably running the biggest managed Linux install base in the world now. They manage the OS and update it. If you really want to get in there and root the thing, you can; you can install other OSes including Windows if you want, it's open, it just defaults to managed. And they made sure to integrate Flatpaks into their base OS image and the default image ships with the Flatpak market/browser, because Flatpaks can be easily installed and managed without conflicting with the base OS that they are managing... and it works. It really works. Even out of the box and without penetrating their management, you have a lot of freedom, and the fences are just advisory. I'm sure they're not interested in it but they've got a decent solution for someone to start selling managed Linux desktops and laptops for end-users if they wanted to.
  - TehCorwiz 2y ago
    You're knocking on Apple's door with that idea. Man, I'd love to see it.
  - wishfish 2y ago
    There's an interesting comparison to ChromeOS here. Thinking about managed Linux desktops for consumers. SteamOS would possibly be a good, more private alternative in the near future if Steam ever released the OS for wide use outside of handhelds. Could imagine people buying SteamOS laptops for grandparents or kids as an alternative to ChromeOS or even iPads.
lawn 2y ago
You can install Windows on the Steam Deck if you want. But calling Windows more free than Linux because you can virtualize Linux is a noteworthy statement alright.
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  That's the exact argument people make on the Steam deck vs Nintendo. "but you can emulate switch games!"
  - lawn 2y ago
    You can virtiualize Windows on Linux too while you can't play Steam Deck games on Switch, so they're not comparable.
butlike 2y ago
It always briefly crosses my mind for a second when I install older games that package some ancient C++ redistributable with the installer.

TehCorwiz 2y ago

I think you're misunderstanding the meaning of "Software freedom". It refers more to the process and transparency of the software than to the choice. That said, the Steam Deck is just a handheld PC. And Valve gives instructions on how to install Windows on it should you want to do that. https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/6121-ECCD-D643-BAA8 https://help.steampowered.com/en/faqs/view/6121-ECCD-D643-BA... Often we talk about software freedom in the context of open-source development and free-software licenses like the GPL. The Free Software Foundation stated as a bootstrapping organization to write open source software for the GNU platform (Linux/Unix standard userspace environment). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Software_Foundation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Software_Foundation Valve is pretty well respected from that perspective. SteamOS is built on Arch Linux. They publish the source for most of their Linux tools https://github.com/ValveSoftware/ https://github.com/ValveSoftware/. The development of Proton, their in-house compatibility layer that uses Wine under the hood, is also open source and developed with community involvement. Single hardware platform makes it easier to handle the morass of driver development. They upstream their changes to other projects. There are actually open source forks of things like Proton (https://github.com/GloriousEggroll/proton-ge-custom https://github.com/GloriousEggroll/proton-ge-custom is a popular one).

jerf 2y ago
I'd also call out that Valve is probably running the biggest managed Linux install base in the world now. They manage the OS and update it. If you really want to get in there and root the thing, you can; you can install other OSes including Windows if you want, it's open, it just defaults to managed. And they made sure to integrate Flatpaks into their base OS image and the default image ships with the Flatpak market/browser, because Flatpaks can be easily installed and managed without conflicting with the base OS that they are managing... and it works. It really works. Even out of the box and without penetrating their management, you have a lot of freedom, and the fences are just advisory. I'm sure they're not interested in it but they've got a decent solution for someone to start selling managed Linux desktops and laptops for end-users if they wanted to.
- TehCorwiz 2y ago
  You're knocking on Apple's door with that idea. Man, I'd love to see it.
- wishfish 2y ago
  There's an interesting comparison to ChromeOS here. Thinking about managed Linux desktops for consumers. SteamOS would possibly be a good, more private alternative in the near future if Steam ever released the OS for wide use outside of handhelds. Could imagine people buying SteamOS laptops for grandparents or kids as an alternative to ChromeOS or even iPads.

lawn 2y ago

You can install Windows on the Steam Deck if you want. But calling Windows more free than Linux because you can virtualize Linux is a noteworthy statement alright.

johnnyanmac 2y ago
That's the exact argument people make on the Steam deck vs Nintendo. "but you can emulate switch games!"
- lawn 2y ago
  You can virtiualize Windows on Linux too while you can't play Steam Deck games on Switch, so they're not comparable.

butlike 2y ago

It always briefly crosses my mind for a second when I install older games that package some ancient C++ redistributable with the installer.